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**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 04:27 PM

MrRash Wrote:

Really??? Do you wake up and think," How can I force people to believe what I believe. I only do it because I love them and they don't know what's best for themselves...ah! Another CREATION thread! That'll do it!"

You are caught within the false Either/Or point of view.

Creation, by which I assume you mean the story from Genesis, is not the only alternative to evolution.

I rejected Christianity after over 20 years as a practitioner of that religion. I no longer consider myself a part of any organized religion.

I say that to say that I am not 'religious' in any sense of the word as you would almost certainly use it.

And I'll tell you something: evolution is even dumber than the creation nonsense I used to believe. The idea that everything we see around us just arose by happenstance is idiotic. It amuses me that people who worship Science fail to see that their point of view requires just as much blind faith as the Fundies they love to feel superior to. Were you alive three billion years ago? No? So you admit you did not witness any of these conditions first hand, yet you blindly rely on the version of events 'scientists' have fed you. You accept it on faith, since there's no other way one can accept statements about life a billion years before you experienced it.

The same scientists who cannot agree whether or not Global Warming is actually happening, or on its causes if it is.

The same scientists who declare that eggs will kill you one week, and that only eggs can save us all from certain heart disease the next.

And now you will say, "Oh, but we have scientific proof of evolution!"

Yeah yeah. At one point they had scientific proof that the world was flat, too. At one time Einstein's theory of relativity was the Scientific Word of God ™. Until quantum theory started poking holes in it. 'Science' has proven fallible time after time, yet they accept the theory of evolution with a blind zeal the Inquisitors would find admirable.

You can have a vast array of 'facts' and still arrive at all the wrong conclusions. But the Evolution Cultists lack the humility to understand that.

They're too busy feeling superior to the christians who accept things on blind faith.

Pfffffffft! chuckle

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91469 04-22-2012 04:31 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
So the IRS rigged courts convicted a tax-exempt church minister for failing to pay taxes. This only proves what Hovind was saying - they are corrupt.

http://freehovind.com/watch
So powerful and far reaching is the influence of fraudulent conman Kent Hovind in a world of 7,000 million people that when a petition to release him is set up, how many people sign it?

14,227.

He is just a pathetic insignificant crook with a small following of close-minded low IQ bible thumpers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 04:40 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

You can have a vast array of 'facts' and still arrive at all the wrong conclusions. But the Evolution Cultists lack the humility to understand that.

They're too busy feeling superior to the christians who accept things on blind faith.

Pfffffffft!

THE BLIND MEN AND THE ELEPHANT

It was six men of Indostan
To learning much inclined,
Who went to see the Elephant
(Though all of them were blind),
That each by observation
Might satisfy his mind.

The First approach'd the Elephant,
And happening to fall
Against his broad and sturdy side,
At once began to bawl:
"God bless me! but the Elephant
Is very like a wall!"

The Second, feeling of the tusk,
Cried, -"Ho! what have we here
So very round and smooth and sharp?
To me 'tis mighty clear
This wonder of an Elephant
Is very like a spear!"

The Third approached the animal,
And happening to take
The squirming trunk within his hands,
Thus boldly up and spake:
"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a snake!"

The Fourth reached out his eager hand,
And felt about the knee.
"What most this wondrous beast is like
Is mighty plain," quoth he,
"'Tis clear enough the Elephant
Is very like a tree!"

The Fifth, who chanced to touch the ear,
Said: "E'en the blindest man
Can tell what this resembles most;
Deny the fact who can,
This marvel of an Elephant
Is very like a fan!"

The Sixth no sooner had begun
About the beast to grope,
Then, seizing on the swinging tail
That fell within his scope,
"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a rope!"

And so these men of Indostan
Disputed loud and long,
Each in his own opinion
Exceeding stiff and strong,
Though each was partly in the right,
And all were in the wrong!

MORAL.

So oft in theologic wars,
The disputants, I ween,
Rail on in utter ignorance
Of what each other mean,
And prate about an Elephant
Not one of them has seen!

John Godfrey Saxe

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91912 04-22-2012 04:42 PM

Axx Wrote:

I like using the World Factbook

USA

religions: Protestant 51.3%, Roman Catholic 23.9%, Mormon 1.7%, other Christian 1.6%, Jewish 1.7%, Buddhist 0.7%, Muslim 0.6%, other or unspecified 2.5%, unaffiliated 12.1%, none 4% (2007 est.)

The 12% unaffiliated just happens to be about the same number as immigration who are mostly Catholic although may be exploring other Christian movements.

Not for lack of college level education, most have just rejected the absurd claims made with evolution theories.

What pea-brained twaddle! Most people who are affiliated to an organised religion DO believe in evolution. It is just a tiny minority of hardline fringe extremists who still hold on to the bronze-age myth of Adam, Eve and Eden. I guess you are one of them.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91912 04-22-2012 04:45 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
LoP Guest Wrote:
So the IRS rigged courts convicted a tax-exempt church minister for failing to pay taxes. This only proves what Hovind was saying - they are corrupt.

http://freehovind.com/watch
So powerful and far reaching is the influence of fraudulent conman Kent Hovind in a world of 7,000 million people that when a petition to release him is set up, how many people sign it?

14,227.

He is just a pathetic insignificant crook with a small following of close-minded low IQ bible thumpers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY

14,227.

I am not wrong, but you clearly are a cretin.
http://freehovind.com/petition

**Arch Phoenix**

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
LoP Guest Wrote:
So powerful and far reaching is the influence of fraudulent conman Kent Hovind in a world of 7,000 million people that when a petition to release him is set up, how many people sign it?

14,227.

He is just a pathetic insignificant crook with a small following of close-minded low IQ bible thumpers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY

14,227.

I am not wrong, but you clearly are a cretin.
http://freehovind.com/petition

its actually 14 1/5th...the 1/5th person had a terrible train accident... Tissue

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 04:48 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

What pea-brained twaddle! Most people who are affiliated to an organised religion DO believe in evolution. It is just a tiny minority of hardline fringe extremists who still hold on to the bronze-age myth of Adam, Eve and Eden. I guess you are one of them.

The bolded part above is very ironic coming from a person who puts his faith in the Religion of Evolution and the Religion(s) of Invisible Sky Ghosts. chuckle

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91912 04-22-2012 04:55 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

Were you alive three billion years ago? No? So you admit you did not witness any of these conditions first hand,

Were you alive 6,000 years ago to witness Adam'n'Eve'n'Eden?

Were you alive 2,000 years ago to witness the hearsay tale of Jesus?

NO! So you admit you did not witness any of these tales first hand, yet you blindly believe the version of events preachers have fed you relying on a bronze-age book so full of laughable innaccuracies and contradictions as to be worthless. That is logical.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 04:57 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
Were you alive three billion years ago? No? So you admit you did not witness any of these conditions first hand,
Were you alive 6,000 years ago to witness Adam'n'Eve'n'Eden?

Were you alive 2,000 years ago to witness the hearsay tale of Jesus?

NO! So you admit you did not witness any of these tales first hand, yet you blindly believe the version of events preachers have fed you relying on a bronze-age book so full of laughable innaccuracies and contradictions as to be worthless. That is logical.

I have already said I am not a Christian.

I have already said I reject religion.

Maybe if you were not so eager to prove me wrong you might be able to hear what I'm saying, O Blind man of indostan! chuckle

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91912 04-22-2012 04:58 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
What pea-brained twaddle! Most people who are affiliated to an organised religion DO believe in evolution. It is just a tiny minority of hardline fringe extremists who still hold on to the bronze-age myth of Adam, Eve and Eden. I guess you are one of them.

The bolded part above is very ironic coming from a person who puts his faith in the Religion of Evolution and the Religion(s) of Invisible Sky Ghosts.

WTF are you waffling on about? Are you drunk or on drugs?

Invisible Sky Ghosts is Neesie's territory.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 05:01 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
LoP Guest Wrote:
What pea-brained twaddle! Most people who are affiliated to an organised religion DO believe in evolution. It is just a tiny minority of hardline fringe extremists who still hold on to the bronze-age myth of Adam, Eve and Eden. I guess you are one of them.

The bolded part above is very ironic coming from a person who puts his faith in the Religion of Evolution and the Religion(s) of Invisible Sky Ghosts.
WTF are you waffling on about? Are you drunk or on drugs?

Invisible Sky Ghosts is Neesie's territory.

Are you not reading the thread? I posted a few times explaining 'WTF I'm waffling about'.

Is the idea that maybe evolution and creation both untru something that has never occurred to you before?

Is your mind so hidebound with conditioning that new ideas bounce off like peas off a steel helmet, as the inimmitable Orwell phrased it?

Tell me, what does that elephant most resemble to you?

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 91912 04-22-2012 05:20 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
WTF are you waffling on about? Are you drunk or on drugs?

Invisible Sky Ghosts is Neesie's territory.

Are you not reading the thread? I posted a few times explaining 'WTF I'm waffling about'.

Is the idea that maybe evolution and creation both untru something that has never occurred to you before?

Evolution is the theory that has the most scientific proof behind it. As for the origin of DNA, I suspect that may have been in existence before the solar system was formed, a remnant of previous star systems and the life forms on planets around it. Check out "Panspermia" and the theories of Fred Hoyle and Chandra Wickramasinghe.

Out of interest, not wanting to search thru user-id numbers to find out which specific "guest" you are, what do you believe?

LoP Guest Wrote:

Is your mind so hidebound with conditioning that new ideas bounce off like peas off a steel helmet, as the inimmitable Orwell phrased it?

Not at all, that is why I am on this site.

LoP Guest Wrote:

Tell me, what does that elephant most resemble to you?

http://elephant.elehost.com/About_Elepha...cestry.gif
http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/1...T_PEKC.jpg
http://eleaid.com/index.php?page=evolution
http://elephant.elehost.com/About_Elepha...ution.html

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 88524 04-22-2012 05:28 PM

Well, if the folks on this forum are anything to go by, I'd say natural selection has failed miserably.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 05:35 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

Out of interest, not wanting to search thru user-id numbers to find out which specific "guest" you are, what do you believe?

Do you mean, what do I believe about the origins of Life?

I confess that I do not know. But this lack of knowledge has never bothered me much. It is possible that Life, the Universe, has always existed in the way Christians believe God has always just existed.

(For Christians reading the thread, think about that idea for a bit. Neither is more or less logical than the other.)

It is possible that Life on this planet arose from the manipulation of aliens (although admittedly that does not address the question of Ultimate Origin of Life).

It is possible that none of what we believe to be Reality is real at all. Perhaps we are the dreaming Consciousness of entities who exist in a world beyond our imagination and that our everyday lives are no more real than the dream you have of Mickey Mouse baking you lemon tarts in a tutu.

I really wanted to point out that by defining the debate as an EITHER/OR question limits our thinking on this topic. Christians do not hear what non-believers say, and the non-believers are unable to see that they have a species of blind faith of their own that confines their thinking to a very narrow, pre-digested Idea.

What I am saying is that just because the Bible is not true does not mean that evolution must be.

And so these debates always degenerate into Public Ego Masturbation and name calling.

And no progress is made in understanding what is really going on here. It's a very subtle form of divide and conquer.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 77388 04-22-2012 05:37 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

Well, if the folks on this forum are anything to go by, I'd say natural selection has failed miserably.

And if you are anything to go by, I would say my Public Ego masturbation theory is sound. chuckle

Can you stop being smarter than other people long enough to have an honest discussion about ideas differing from your own?