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**Oh Bother :P**

LoP Guest Wrote:

Oh Bother :P Wrote:
Guitar Doctor Wrote:
Brilliant!
Who was going to believe some wacked out hippies anyway.

precisely

You're not worthy of those signature lines.

You're not worthy of judging anyones worth Heartflowers

**Ahriman**

Johntaraz Wrote:

Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

12. And I raised my voice a second time and said to him, "What are the two olive branches beside the two golden vats that empty out the gold[en oil] from themselves?"

http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/...rashi/true

Ida & Pingala. Heartflowers

**Shakey1** · **Shakey1** Subscriber User ID: 78542 06-22-2012 06:27 AM **Posts: 11,986**

Ahriman Wrote:

Check out this book Shakey1. The Apocalypse Unsealed. I highlighted the ida & pingala.

http://archive.org/stream/cu319240292952...26+pingala

Bookmarked for later, thanks.

**Johntaraz**

Ahriman Wrote:

Johntaraz Wrote:
Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

12. And I raised my voice a second time and said to him, "What are the two olive branches beside the two golden vats that empty out the gold[en oil] from themselves?"

http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/...rashi/true

Ida & Pingala.

That is an interesting exposition. The origins of the terminology and meanings are important to understand. I have not read Rashi commentary that I can remember. Although some Aramaic texts, translations, and commentary has been helpful in research and authenticity.
It is a description of some essence (spirit) that moves through a process of transmutation and refinement. That is more than I fathomed from Ryrie et al.
I will bookmark your link and read more.
Thanks, Ahriman.

**Ahriman**

Johntaraz Wrote:

Ahriman Wrote:
Johntaraz Wrote:
Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

12. And I raised my voice a second time and said to him, "What are the two olive branches beside the two golden vats that empty out the gold[en oil] from themselves?"

http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/...rashi/true

Ida & Pingala.
That is an interesting exposition. The origins of the terminology and meanings are important to understand. I have not read Rashi commentary that I can remember. Although some Aramaic texts, translations, and commentary has been helpful in research and authenticity.
It is a description of some essence (spirit) that moves through a process of transmutation and refinement. That is more than I fathomed from Ryrie et al.
I will bookmark your link and read more.
Thanks, Ahriman.

Your welcome! Cheers

I grabbed a couple blurbs from the commentary:

that empty out the gold[en oil] from themselves: This oil that is clear and good to illuminate like gold, as in (Job 37:22): “From the north comes gold.”

The North is considered the head, the brain. The king of the South would be the infernal regions below the solar plexus chakra (stomach & kidneys) which would be the sacral & base chakras. These are represented as the 1/3 of the fallen angels.

two anointed ones: The horns of the priesthood and the kingdom who are anointed with the anointing oil.

Replenishing the chakras.... Jhikpghf

Shakey1 Wrote:

Bookmarked for later, thanks.

Yor welcome! Cheers

**Scribe to Elijah**

According to Revelation 11:6, a time soon to come, these two men will have the power that they once had in the days of their empowerment as recounted in the O.T., namely, Elijah, having control over the rain; and Moses, having power over the waters to turn them to blood.

During the time of the great tribulation, the spirit of these two prophets will again be apparent in two men chosen by Almighty God who will given to be in the holy city (Jerusalem) for 42 months, Revelation 11:1-13, at which time their power will be greatly increased as we see in verses 5-6, KJV. Their power will be given them through the anointing of the Lord. Zechariah 4:14.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TwoOliveTrees/

**Shakey1** · **Shakey1** Subscriber User ID: 78542 06-22-2012 11:39 AM **Posts: 11,986**

Scribe to Elijah Wrote:

According to Revelation 11:6, a time soon to come, these two men will have the power that they once had in the days of their empowerment as recounted in the O.T., namely, Elijah, having control over the rain; and Moses, having power over the waters to turn them to blood.

During the time of the great tribulation, the spirit of these two prophets will again be apparent in two men chosen by Almighty God who will given to be in the holy city (Jerusalem) for 42 months, Revelation 11:1-13, at which time their power will be greatly increased as we see in verses 5-6, KJV. Their power will be given them through the anointing of the Lord. Zechariah 4:14.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TwoOliveTrees/

I'm not a literal subscriber to much that is in the Bible, but I do believe that the two witnesses will be two dudes (not a chakra representation, or another metaphysical allegory), and the Moses, Elijah incarnations make sense (not 100% sold on them making the waters turn blood, etc., however).

Who knows for sure? Not me chuckle

**Scribe to Elijah**

Shakey1 Wrote:

Scribe to Elijah Wrote:
According to Revelation 11:6, a time soon to come, these two men will have the power that they once had in the days of their empowerment as recounted in the O.T., namely, Elijah, having control over the rain; and Moses, having power over the waters to turn them to blood.

During the time of the great tribulation, the spirit of these two prophets will again be apparent in two men chosen by Almighty God who will given to be in the holy city (Jerusalem) for 42 months, Revelation 11:1-13, at which time their power will be greatly increased as we see in verses 5-6, KJV. Their power will be given them through the anointing of the Lord. Zechariah 4:14.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TwoOliveTrees/

I'm not a literal subscriber to much that is in the Bible, but I do believe that the two witnesses will be two dudes (not a chakra representation, or another metaphysical allegory), and the Moses, Elijah incarnations make sense (not 100% sold on them making the waters turn blood, etc., however).

Who knows for sure? Not me

The only thing we've got to go on is the Bible and the Holy Spirit. We know His Word must be fulfilled for there is no higher authority for truth than that of Almighty God.

**Axx** lop guest User ID: 103393 06-22-2012 12:15 PM

The two witnesses/candlesticks were fulfilled in 1789 during the French Revolution and following events.

To understand this and other chapters, when it was/is, we must first understand a Bible truth: day-year principle

The 42 months or 1260 days was mentioned twice telling us when this was - following the 1260 days.

When was this?

The prophecy is filled with symbolism, thus the prophetic time given is also symbolic day=year or 1260 years of dark age holy roman empire ending at the French Revolution.

The French Revolution was atheistic (spiritually Sodom & Egypt) they banned the Bible (two witnesses/candlesticks). After this these two witnesses stood on their feet and went to the whole world.

Watch Walter Veith's video: The Beast from the Bottomless Pit

This beast from the pit is the Illuminati NWO and important to understand endtime events most today fail to grasp all distracted by Israel and Christian-Zionism.

**Shakey1** · **Shakey1** Subscriber User ID: 78542 06-22-2012 12:23 PM **Posts: 11,986**

Axx Wrote:

The two witnesses/candlesticks were fulfilled in 1789 during the French Revolution and following events.

To understand this and other chapters, when it was/is, we must first understand a Bible truth: day-year principle

The 42 months or 1260 days was mentioned twice telling us when this was - following the 1260 days.

When was this?

The prophecy is filled with symbolism, thus the prophetic time given is also symbolic day=year or 1260 years of dark age holy roman empire ending at the French Revolution.

The French Revolution was atheistic (spiritually Sodom & Egypt) they banned the Bible (two witnesses/candlesticks). After this these two witnesses stood on their feet and went to the whole world.

Watch Walter Veith's video: The Beast from the Bottomless Pit

This beast from the pit is the Illuminati NWO and important to understand endtime events most today fail to grasp all distracted by Israel and Christian-Zionism.

**Axx** lop guest User ID: 103393 06-22-2012 12:23 PM

The pit beast arises at that time in 1798 the French Revolution, the Illuminati & NWO.

:

Rv.11:1-4 "And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and three score days, clothed in sackcloth. These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth."

This 1260 day period is mentioned several times in scripture, all referring to Rome's dark ages.

Dn.7:25 = time, times and a half (1260)
Dn.12:7 = time, times and a half (1260)
Rv.11:2 = 42 months (1260)
Rv.11:3 = 1260 days
Rv.12:6 = 1260 days
Rv.12:14 = time, times and a half (1260)
Rv.13:5 = 42 months (1260)

Most find Daniel 9's "70 weeks" or 490 days to be 490 years. (using day-year principle)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-year_principle

Prophetic time is always day = year.

The 1260 years have been identified when Rome's Empire fell in 476 AD (Dn.7 beast & ten horns) and 'holy' Rome (little horn) arose ruling from 538 to 1798 when Napoleon ended the Papal States.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_states
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3082/28803...d39cdd.jpg

Thus the Rev 11 two witnesses happened at that time in 1798 France. ("spiritual Sodom and Egypt" i.e. atheist)

At that time the Bible was banned for 3.5 years.

After this the Bible was mass produced and went to all of Christendom.

Revelation is a book of prophecy which uses symbolism.

The symbolism from Rev 11 comes from Zech 4 and 5, which is about the word of God (candlesticks which are a witness)

Zech.4:3 "And two olive trees by it, one on the right side of the bowl, and the other on the left side thereof. So I answered and spoke to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord? Then the angel that talked with me answered and said to me, Know you not what these be? And I said, No, my lord. Then he answered and spoke to me, saying, This is the word of the LORD (...) Then answered I, and said to him, What are these two olive trees on the right side of the candlestick and on the left side thereof? And I answered again, and said to him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves? And he answered me and said, Know you not what these be? And I said, No, my lord. Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the LORD of the whole earth. Then I turned, and lifted up my eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll."

:

The most popular opinion found among the Doctors of Theology is that the two witnesses are two prophets that shall come during the Great Tribulation Period, while some say that this prophecy of the two witnesses has a two-fold meaning. However, the Scriptures and recorded history show that the prophecy about the two witnesses has indeed come to pass.

Jesus our Lord said: "And this Gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a WITNESS UNTO ALL NATIONS and then shall the end come." (Matthew 24:14). The Gospel taught from the Scriptures was to be a witness to all nations about the loving and saving power of Jesus Christ.

However, when the Roman Catholic Church became a religious dictatorship, the Scriptures were hidden from the vast population, and catechism was substituted instead of Bible study. The Gospel of the Bible became mingled with the pagan philosophies of Sun worship. The worship of the pagan Mother goddess became the idol of the Roman Catholic Church through the worship of the Virgin Mary.' When the Gospel became perverted through Romanism, God always had a remnant people who were teaching the True Faith during the 1260 years the Papacy cast the Truth to the ground. These faithful followers of Jesus were hunted down by papal authorities as heretics and criminals. They were tortured on the rack, burned at the stake; and it mattered not what age or sex, they were butchered in the name of Heaven.

When those faithful servants who proclaimed the sacred truths from the Old and New Testaments were tortured, murdered, thrown in dungeons and had to flee for their lives from the papal Inquisitors, the True Faith was forced to go underground. The Gospel set forth in the Old and New Testament that had to be preached into all the world for a witness to all nations before Christ would come again, was forced into a state of obscurity. This is what is meant by Revelation 11:3, "And they shall prophesy a THOUSAND TWO HUNDRED AND THREESCORE DAYS CLOTHED IN SACKCLOTH."

Sackcloth was worn by the Israelites in times of trouble and grief (2.Samuel 3:31, 1.Chronicles 21:15, 16; Isaiah 37:1). The sackcloth here mentioned in Revelation 11:3 was to mourn the supression of the Old and New Testament by the papal authorities during the 1260 years. The two witnesses, the two olive trees, or the two candlesticks represented the light the Scripture gives its reader.

The Olive Tree was the Israelites' source of oil to anoint their kings and priests. Oil has often, in Biblical language, been a symbol of the Holy Spirit (Zechariah 4:1-14). The Candlestick represents the illumination a searcher of Truth receives in the heart when he makes the Word of God his standard to measure Truth to live by. "Thy word is a LAMP unto my feet, and a light unto my path." Psalms 119:105

"And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouths, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy. And have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will." Revelation 11:5,6

This prophecy is a parallel with that of Jesus in Revelation 22:18,19. "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the Holy City, and from the things which are written in this book."

This will be the fate of ALL those who tamper with the sacred Scripture. These warnings were given by God to warn men against changing or adding to anything written in the Holy Scriptures. The Scriptures reveal God's plan for man from the beginning of creation until Christ's Second Coming, and also how he will provide for man after this Age. The Scriptures were given for man as a guide throughout his life to lead him through the gates of the New Jerusalem where he will dwell with God himself (Revelation 21:1-4).
http://www.benabraham.com/html/illuminati_-_3.html
http://www.temkit.com/08-Bible-Prophecy/...rev_11.htm
http://www.revelationbibleprophecy.org/r...ion11.html
http://www.bibleexplained.com/revelation...3-search4w
http://www.revelations-two-witnesses.com
http://www.endtimes-bibleprophecy.com/page16.htm
http://www.lightministries.com/id95.htm

The prophecy could not be understood until it had been fulfilled.

Besides understanding the day-year principle it is important to understand previous chapters 9 & 10, as these were also about the Bible. Ch 9 was the fall of Constantinople at the hands of the Turks in 1453. Ch 10 was the Protestant Reformation in 1517 and Bible made possible by the preserved Greek MS brought west after the fall of Constantinople.

This fellow covers Ch10 rather well although you or I do not have to agree with him 100% since he mixes schools of theology but still presents the gist of Chs 9 & 10. Then Veith covers Ch11 smashing it out of the park.

Rev 10: Protestant Reformation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEkHdYzQORc

Rev 11: Two witnesses/candlesticks, symbolic for the word of God, the Bible; the law and the prophets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGiXc9ydhqw

**Powhatan**

Ahriman Wrote:

Johntaraz Wrote:
Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

12. And I raised my voice a second time and said to him, "What are the two olive branches beside the two golden vats that empty out the gold[en oil] from themselves?"

http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/...rashi/true

Ida & Pingala.

Elijah and the Baptist were different branches from the same tree.
Not reincarnation, their spirits, symbolically represented by oil, came from the same unique source [the olive tree].
One of the witnesses is also from that "tree".

**Scribe to Elijah**

Axx Wrote:

The two witnesses/candlesticks were fulfilled in 1789 during the French Revolution and following events.

To understand this and other chapters, when it was/is, we must first understand a Bible truth: day-year principle

The 42 months or 1260 days was mentioned twice telling us when this was - following the 1260 days.

When was this?

The prophecy is filled with symbolism, thus the prophetic time given is also symbolic day=year or 1260 years of dark age holy roman empire ending at the French Revolution.

The French Revolution was atheistic (spiritually Sodom & Egypt) they banned the Bible (two witnesses/candlesticks). After this these two witnesses stood on their feet and went to the whole world.

Watch Walter Veith's video: The Beast from the Bottomless Pit

This beast from the pit is the Illuminati NWO and important to understand endtime events most today fail to grasp all distracted by Israel and Christian-Zionism.

Be careful whom you follow. The Word of God has all the truth you need.

Walter Veith is a Seventh Day Adventist who follows Ellen G. White's teachings. She has a giant Masonic occult obelisk parked on her grave. She was closely associated with Freemasons, and was married to a Freemason. Freemasons, whether knowingly or not, follow Lucifer or the Devil.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 100013 06-22-2012 02:41 PM

Johntaraz Wrote:

Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

Chapter 5 is a continuation of chapter 4 and it is about Iraq (Shinar) and the curse that would be upon the whole earth! King Nebuchednasser of Babylon (Iraq) stole the golden vessels from the temple of Solomon and destroyed the temple then a curse was put upon Iraq to be upon the whole world, the roll (scroll) is the same dimentions as the porchway of the destroyed temple.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea...ersion=KJV

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 100013 06-22-2012 02:45 PM

LoP Guest Wrote:

Johntaraz Wrote:
Zechariah chapter 4 provides a description of the purpose of the 2 witnesses.

Chapter 5 is a continuation of chapter 4 and it is about Iraq (Shinar) and the curse that would be upon the whole earth! King Nebuchednasser of Babylon (Iraq) stole the golden vessels from the temple of Solomon and destroyed the temple then a curse was put upon Iraq to be upon the whole world, the roll (scroll) is the same dimentions as the porchway of the destroyed temple.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea...ersion=KJV

Behold it is the same woman as mentioned in book of revelation:

6 And I said, What is it? And he said, This is an ephah that goeth forth. He said moreover, This is their resemblance through all the earth.

7 And, behold, there was lifted up a talent of lead: and this is a woman that sitteth in the midst of the ephah.

8 And he said, This is wickedness. And he cast it into the midst of the ephah; and he cast the weight of lead upon the mouth thereof.

9 Then lifted I up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came out two women, and the wind was in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork: and they lifted up the ephah between the earth and the heaven.

10 Then said I to the angel that talked with me, Whither do these bear the ephah?

11 And he said unto me, To build it an house in the land of Shinar: and it shall be established, and set there upon her own base.