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**The Martini Maven**

no

it's bunk and false advertising

**Vegas** · **Vegas** Crisis Actor User ID: 50831 04-16-2012 08:53 AM **Posts: 18,551**

Obama's little tin soldier man W.B. rubber mouthing the Washington liberal bullshit... The tax rates are not the problem, in fact, they are all too high... It is the loopholes the Washington elites create for themselves and their elitist friends to avoid paying taxes that is the problem...

Worthless pieces of shit like Obama and Buffet who tout this bullshit are the first ones in line to take advantage of the same shit they publicly denounce... Of course the hourly worker is not able to take advantage of those loopholes so middle-class America and the poor continue subsidizing the wealthy... People in this country sure are some dumb fuckers...

S977

**David** · **David** regulate this! User ID: 89685 04-16-2012 09:39 AM **Posts: 31,472**

Vegas Wrote:

Obama's little tin soldier man W.B. rubber mouthing the Washington liberal bullshit... The tax rates are not the problem, in fact, they are all too high... It is the loopholes the Washington elites create for themselves and their elitist friends to avoid paying taxes that is the problem...

Worthless pieces of shit like Obama and Buffet who tout this bullshit are the first ones in line to take advantage of the same shit they publicly denounce... Of course the hourly worker is not able to take advantage of those loopholes so middle-class America and the poor continue subsidizing the wealthy... People in this country sure are some dumb fuckers...

True elite rape of the sub-elite even if they closed the loopholes -- which they wouldn't.

It would merely be funneled upward in the next round of bailouts (inevitable).

Kick it up.

But that ain't gonna happen.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 90632 04-16-2012 10:40 AM

Geogal Wrote:

Sunny Wrote:
JF Priest Wrote:
Good Post.. There is a lot of Smoke and Mirrors that the rich use to hide their income.. Remember GE paid no Income tax...Since the Buffet rule was brought to show how unfair the tax code is (Remember the income tax goes for nothing more than the Interest on the Federal Debt)..And (the income tax was started as a20e percent tax on the richest one percent) why not just go to a consumption tax?? When you spend is when you get taxed.. Spend more more tax..(You would get your entire paycheck each week.. No taxes taken off)

This is the simplest and fairest way to tax. No income tax. Sales tax only. Tax percentage goes up with amount of purchase, "luxury items" will be taxed the highest.

No sales tax to resold goods of any kinds--tax only ONCE!
basic foods shouldn't be taxed, but ANY luxury should be.

Also, if things like weed were sold and taxed properly... it would be safer (no lacing) and it would make the states revenue and it's a great oxygen producer.

+1000 to both posts.

The current tax system is the most complicated, unfair, and expensive way to tax ever created by humans. The amount of time and money spent and wasted on tax returns is beyond absurd.

Would the IRS ever let a sales tax replace the income tax? Would any president dare to eliminate such a massive federal bureaucracy? Could they ever have the guts to reduce the size of the government? B/c if there were no income tax, there would be no need for the IRS.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 90632 04-16-2012 10:46 AM

David Wrote:

Vegas Wrote:
Obama's little tin soldier man W.B. rubber mouthing the Washington liberal bullshit... The tax rates are not the problem, in fact, they are all too high... It is the loopholes the Washington elites create for themselves and their elitist friends to avoid paying taxes that is the problem...

Worthless pieces of shit like Obama and Buffet who tout this bullshit are the first ones in line to take advantage of the same shit they publicly denounce... Of course the hourly worker is not able to take advantage of those loopholes so middle-class America and the poor continue subsidizing the wealthy... People in this country sure are some dumb fuckers...

True elite rape of the sub-elite even if they closed the loopholes -- which they wouldn't.

It would merely be funneled upward in the next round of bailouts (inevitable).

Kick it up.

But that ain't gonna happen.

Man that picture speaks volumes.

and makes all those who are still trapped in the matrix of the false left-right paradigm that much more pathetically ignorant tools of the system that totally controls them.

voting for either party is voting for the same party.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 90632 04-16-2012 10:56 AM

encephaloid Wrote:

I don't think the buffet rule goes far enough. I would close the loopholes too. What's ignored most in this whole argument is that the ultra wealthy through Political Action Committees, Lobbyists, Political Parties and other entities have monopolized Representation in the United States. Your letters go to the shredder as soon as they are answered by a staffer mailing a form letter from your elected official while he golfs or dines with his high class political whore. Since taxation was originally linked to representation, the representation alone that is given to a minority of the population is reason enough to justify them paying more for the services, defense and infrastructure government is supposed to provide. To me this is non-negotiable. Nothing will change my mind on this issue.

And nothing should.

Great Post.

BJ lop guest User ID: 90635 04-16-2012 11:32 AM

A post from TOP, dated 6/20/07, by AC:

"Democracy btw means that 50.001% of the people get to tell that other 49.999% what to do.

But then the democracy we are speaking of on this or any other bill is a simple majority (or 2/3's majority) of 536 People... a.k.a. Congress.

Now, let's consider this for a moment, there are roughly 300 Million US Citizens being represented by these 535 Congress Critters +1 VP. that is a total of 536 people... now those 536 make up 536/300,000,000 = .00000178% of the people.

This is representative democracy? And so we see that those .00000178% decide what the rest of us, the 99.99999822% can or can not do."

We are not a "democracy", we are a "republic"! (cough, cough) However, we are given the "privilege" of voting for the few that are sent to Washington to do our will and not their own. We haven't seen that for well over 100 years! Congress has delegated their power to a bunch of alphabet agencies that make law. This was unthinkable way back when.

So...we are debating over who will be the next president, which is diverting our attention from the real problem...those who sit in power in the "hallowed halls of Congress". If we don't take this seriously, NOTHING WILL CHANGE. The current crop can be bribed because money talks to power, and at the expense of all the principles this nation was founded upon.

It's better right now to vote at the voting booth than vote with bullets later on, just as those did who fought in the Revolutionary War if we are to save this country for ourselves, so our kids can breathe free.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 14880 04-16-2012 12:13 PM

Is there any proof you have that shows the buffet rule doesn't affect the ultra rich? Or are we just shooting down an Obama policy again cos some republican scum is lying about it?

**JF Priest** · **JF Priest** Subscriber User ID: 47416 04-16-2012 12:57 PM **Posts: 23,868**

LoP Guest Wrote:

Is there any proof you have that shows the buffet rule doesn't affect the ultra rich? Or are we just shooting down an Obama policy again cos some republican scum is lying about it?

see post 33

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 14880 04-16-2012 01:10 PM

JF Priest Wrote:

LoP Guest Wrote:
Is there any proof you have that shows the buffet rule doesn't affect the ultra rich? Or are we just shooting down an Obama policy again cos some republican scum is lying about it?

see post 33

What post 33?
And do you know more about what is stated in the law except that there is still some room left for people to use some loopholes (like foundations as is stated). Is it really closing a lot of loopholes, just not all?
Are we better of making this first step or are we better of stopping the law? What is the benefit of stopping the law?

**Old Whatshisname**

LoP Guest Wrote:

If so can I ask why? First before you answer please consider the Buffet rule will not really affect the ultra wealthy like Buffet. It is really smoke and mirror's the ultra wealthy hide their income in Tax Exempt Charitable Foundations, in fact Buffet keep's his Billion's in Bill Gates Foundation.

Therefore why would anyone support the Buffet rule? Even if you are for higher taxes on the ultra wealthy wouldn't you be demanding Obama close the tax loopholes? If those loopholes were closed the mega rich would be paying a lot more money then they would under the Buffet rule.

In reality the Buffet rule helps the mega wealthy cut down on competition since they have had a long time to develop their wealth smoke and mirror's that's what the Buffet rule really is.

I am againsst all taxes; I consider them simply theft.

But if we must have some sort of minimal tax to fund things that the individuals citizen needs but can't afrord (like, say, national defense), then each person should pay an amount equal to what he gets from the government in goods and services.

If you assume that all Americns benefit equally from those big ticket items, then all Americans should pay the same. If that conrucopia of goods and services costs $3,500, then you and I and Buffet should pay $3,500 each.

Charging a person more for the same goods and services because he has more money to spend doesn't make sense, any more than charging you an extra ten bucks a gallon for gas or an extra dollar for a loaf of bread because you have a bigger paycheck than I.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 88087 04-16-2012 03:27 PM

Ultima_Thule Wrote:

I support the Buffett rule.

Mitt Romney admitted to paying about 15% in incomes taxes last year.

I paid close to 30% and so did every other working stiff because the majority of our income comes from a paycheck that is taxed differently from investments.

So to take it a step further. I think the income tax, should be the same as the capital gains tax rate. That way, bazzilionaires can't get away with what they are currently getting away with.

I also think it's wrong that companies like GE made billions in profit last year and paid ZERO in federal income taxes. Yet, I had to pay money out of my own pocket in federal income taxes.

I just want the same deal that the millionaires and corporations get. If they want to keep paying 15%, that's fine. Just let me in on the game.

Do you understand the part about the mega wealthy hiding their incomes in tax shelters? That is why they can pass less of a percentage and that would still be the same with the Buffet rule. It's the LOOPHOLES they have built into the system.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 88087 04-16-2012 03:34 PM

Vegas Wrote:

Obama's little tin soldier man W.B. rubber mouthing the Washington liberal bullshit... The tax rates are not the problem, in fact, they are all too high... It is the loopholes the Washington elites create for themselves and their elitist friends to avoid paying taxes that is the problem...

Worthless pieces of shit like Obama and Buffet who tout this bullshit are the first ones in line to take advantage of the same shit they publicly denounce... Of course the hourly worker is not able to take advantage of those loopholes so middle-class America and the poor continue subsidizing the wealthy... People in this country sure are some dumb fuckers...

Buffet is already in line to make money AGAIN off "affordable housing"
Warren Buffett’s latest tax dodge

http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.c...dge/481806

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 79462 04-16-2012 03:54 PM

Ron Paul was the beginning of the solution.
You blew it again America and I'm afraid this was your last chance.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 89575 04-16-2012 04:00 PM

It seems to me that they'll do anything they can to keep from reducing the size of government.
So I say no new taxes on anyone until they've done what's right and drastically reduced the size of the federal government.
It needs to operate within it's declining income levels just like the rest of us.

We need a national conversation about the role of government. It's all spelled out in the constitution but nobody pays any attention to that anymore.

We can no longer afford to be an empire and as they destroy the currency it's going to take more and more of it just to maintain.

NO NEW TAXES on ANYONE!