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**Luvapottamus**

The Librarian Wrote:

Luvapottamus Wrote:
The Librarian Wrote:
We've been around before... The caveman story you have been told is only partially true. The ancients reached a level of high technology and then nature kicked their asses back into "cave man" life....

Norte and meso america wasn't "cave men"

The Macah in Washington state had planed/milled wood houses, just like old Clint Eastwood movies.

12,000 years ago, "America" was "Atlantis". That is why the Rosicrucians and the Baconians refer to America as the "New Atlantis". They were flying back then, had electricity and who knows what else.... The "aliens" aren't from distant galaxies, the "aliens" are us....

That's interesting, but I think not.

Aliens may be us,

But I'm blanking on atlantis.

Choctaws have multiple origin myths.

5 of them.

I did study that, so I'm a bit expert on that.

One of them is they rose from a mound, Nanih Waiya in Mississippi.

I'm a bit drunk at the moment, but they do have several origin myths where they rose from the ocean.

So maybe?

But my general understanding of Mississipian culture is it's related to Aztec culture and lower cultures(geographically)

Generally there people were like all people and thewy trade and adapt to trade.

So if there were no pilgrims, we'd still have advanced technology and cultures on this continent.

So would Africa, if they hadn't been colonized.

And robbed of that.

**Rager** lop guest User ID: 113404 08-17-2012 07:10 AM

Why don't you go back to that "simpler" lifestyle? Is it that hard to give everything up?

I know it is for you, so I guess that's a rhetorical question.

It's like when you said you would leave...then just changed socks...then posted with your sock

You like to talk, but don't do anything to back up your word. Instead of just talking about it why not do it?

**Strategos**

I agree

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 115059 08-17-2012 07:32 AM

The Librarian Wrote:

Luvapottamus Wrote:
They would have traded.

This is a silly thread.

The people here would have modernized.

What are you trying to say? The Natives would have corrupted themselves anyways..... Please elaborate...

Yes, they would have corrupted themselves anyways.

The Natives of the Americas were not the naive "noble savages" portrayed in the History Books of modern-day romanticists.

For thousands of years, from Tierra Del Fuego to the Aleutian Islands, numerous Native groups developed trade routes that saw not only basic manufactured goods such as metals being traded, but also commerce in ideas. (The Mayans and Aztecs had similar calendars, the Inca were great road builders, the Anazasi and Hohokum used advanced irrigation systems,
the Iroqouis Confederation had a political system likened to a Republic).

Had trade with Europeans evolved without European Settlement, Native Americans would undoubtedly adopted the newly introduced technology and ideas.

The fact that many Plains Indians quickly adapted using the Horse just years after its introduction to the Americas by the Spanish is one example. Countless others exist, ranging from adopting firearms for hunting, using metal pots for cooking, utilising different methods for making clothes, political formations based on European ideas, etc.

BTW, using the word "Corrupted" indicates that the poster using it is a moran.

Pi Infinity User ID: 3.14159265 08-17-2012 07:40 AM

Luvapottamus Wrote:

The Librarian Wrote:
Luvapottamus Wrote:
Norte and meso america wasn't "cave men"

The Macah in Washington state had planed/milled wood houses, just like old Clint Eastwood movies.

12,000 years ago, "America" was "Atlantis". That is why the Rosicrucians and the Baconians refer to America as the "New Atlantis". They were flying back then, had electricity and who knows what else.... The "aliens" aren't from distant galaxies, the "aliens" are us....

That's interesting, but I think not.

Aliens may be us,

But I'm blanking on atlantis.

Choctaws have multiple origin myths.

5 of them.

I did study that, so I'm a bit expert on that.

One of them is they rose from a mound, Nanih Waiya in Mississippi.

I'm a bit drunk at the moment, but they do have several origin myths where they rose from the ocean.

So maybe?

But my general understanding of Mississipian culture is it's related to Aztec culture and lower cultures(geographically)

Generally there people were like all people and thewy trade and adapt to trade.

So if there were no pilgrims, we'd still have advanced technology and cultures on this continent.

So would Africa, if they hadn't been colonized.

And robbed of that.

Well. Here's something to consider. The human body is roughly (depending on the person / diet) 75% water. The earth is roughly 75% water.

Pretty good chance we originate from the ocean with just that in observation.

**mstra** lop guest User ID: 115087 08-17-2012 08:04 AM

Luvapottamus Wrote:

Norte and meso america wasn't "cave men"

The Macah in Washington state had planed/milled wood houses, just like old Clint Eastwood movies.

The NW Coastal tribes had a complex society and had traded with the Russians for centuries before the first western European settlers arrived there. Most likely with the Chinese as well; they NW peoples had some small steel tools, such as a cutting bit on an adze. There are likely ballast stones from China in the harbor at Coos Bay OR.

But they didn't live in planed/milled houses. Their longhouses were made of split red cedar. Big trees that split straight and true into relatively flat planks. The large canoes (if 70 feet is still a canoe) were logs hollowed out by burning and scraping, with finishing done with an adze. No planing or milling.

The book "Cedar" by Hillary Stewart covers the tech very well, all of it.

**mstra** lop guest User ID: 115087 08-17-2012 08:15 AM

Y'know spikky, if you really wanted to try the hunter gatherer nature lifestyle there are enormous areas of the western US where no one would notice you or care, still. I've spent a lot of time in them; maybe you should try it. Instead of watching TV and reading about it.

I happen to like the trappings of civilization too, like this computer, my Swiss carving chisels, electric guitars, pianos, books, bicycles and hot showers with soap. Electric lights are nice too. All invented by the evil white man.

**Blue Waffle**

The Librarian Wrote:

There would be no nuclear plants, no pollution, no money, no chemically treated water, no police, no bureaucratic laws, no prisons, no drugs (aside from the natural ones), no jobs, no taxes, no elderly people scared of death, no gangs, children respected their parents, religion was a respect of nature and balance.....

But we had to make way for "progress", right....

Had to get rid of the "savages".....

Hmmmm.... Camping with people you know and love 24/7.... Everyday waking up to the beauty of nature and sharing new adventures with your brothers and sisters....

I'd trade my laptop, car, job and apartment for it... Would you?

So North America would have isolated itself from the rest of the world?

Probably not.

Maybe it'd be a continent sized casino...

**Blue Waffle** · (This post was last modified: 08-17-2012 08:47 AM by Blue Waffle.)

LoP Guest Wrote:

The mexicans would have claimed the land.

Spaniard = White European

**Blue Waffle**

Emma Peel Wrote:

The "savages" also enjoyed killing other tribes so essentially they could have wiped each other out. Gangs are nothing new.

I've been watching old westerns lately and it's interesting how the portrayal of death was just as much part of life and quite matter-of-fact. Steal horses? Get hanged. Ger sick? Probably die. Wasn't a big deal, unlike today where prisons are big business just like big pharma is. So, with infant mortality rates, sickness, accidents and hangings, this kept the population under control.

Everything I ever needed to know about Native Americans I learned from old Westerns...

**Janus**

The Librarian Wrote:

There would be no nuclear plants, no pollution, no money, no chemically treated water, no police, no bureaucratic laws, no prisons, no drugs (aside from the natural ones), no jobs, no taxes, no elderly people scared of death, no gangs, children respected their parents, religion was a respect of nature and balance.....

But we had to make way for "progress", right....

Had to get rid of the "savages".....

Hmmmm.... Camping with people you know and love 24/7.... Everyday waking up to the beauty of nature and sharing new adventures with your brothers and sisters....

I'd trade my laptop, car, job and apartment for it... Would you?

Do it then.
Camping stuff is cheap at Walmart. Get rid of everything but your
car and laptop, load up your trunk with a tent, sleeping bag, Rambo
knife and a sewing kit and head out.

National forest camping allows 14-16 days in one spot before you
have to move, (if the few and far between rangers catch you)

**roadtoad** · (This post was last modified: 08-17-2012 08:21 PM by roadtoad.)

before europeans, as many as half a million people lived in california, 20 different language groups, in relative equaminty, without a single jail, nor a single police person, Lets see any white group, claim that.
Then try to figure out who is really civilized and who is not.
And, if you think about it, most of your great 'inventions' were made for war.
Only a few advanced individuals, such as Tesla, was against war, and he was murdered.

**Leopardsands** · **Leopardsands** Goth Pug User ID: 76478 08-17-2012 08:26 PM **Posts: 13,699**

I do think Europeans rushed into things.
If Caucasians didn't the Chinese would have.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 113466 08-17-2012 08:33 PM

http://www.amazon.com/Aztec-Century-Pb-C...0575057122

That plague changed everything..

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 106021 08-17-2012 09:09 PM

Then north America would have been Indians.