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**PsychoticBlonde**

What if you leave something with someone to keep it safe for a short time and then when you ask for it back they claim "you can't have it because you gave it to them"? When you did no such thing... ?????? WTF.. is that theft or what?

BTW, the item being claimed is an antique spanish shotgun..

Thank You

**PsychoticBlonde**

Does anyone know if I have grounds? Heartflowers

**daisy** lop guest User ID: 48475 08-08-2012 02:43 AM

circa 12 Wrote:

What if you leave something with someone to keep it safe for a short time and then when you ask for it back they claim "you can't have it because you gave it to them"? When you did no such thing... ?????? WTF.. is that theft or what?

BTW, the item being claimed is an antique spanish shotgun..

Thank You

you both would have had to fill out a form and filed it ( I believe with your local state authorities), as to have this in possession means you need to have a gun license. at that point the person who is 'lending' or selling it, indicates this.

with no paper trail its just he said she said.

**Luvapottamus**

You have a claim.

It's not theft because you entrusted them with it, but it is unjust enrichment.

Might be difficult to prove, but depends on the judge.

Here's an example:

This girl left a couch with some roommates when she moved out. About a year later she came back to get it and complained it smelled like cigarettes, beer, and pee etc.

chuckle

So she sued these two friends of mine who were her former roommates.

She won. Her story was credible, and they didn't cut their hair for court.

Lmao

**Luvapottamus** · (This post was last modified: 08-08-2012 02:51 AM by Luvapottamus.)

You don't need a license or paperwork for a shotgun in most states.

You should have gotten a receipt. But that rarely happens among friends.

The judge in a small claims case isn't gonna weigh gun registration crap anyway, it's a property claim.

If this friend didn't give you anything of value it's not likely their claim it was a gift will pass muster. Depends on the judge and who they believe.

**daisy** lop guest User ID: 48475 08-08-2012 02:53 AM

Luvapottamus Wrote:

You have a claim.

It's not theft because you entrusted them with it, but it is unjust enrichment.

Might be difficult to prove, but depends on the judge.

Here's an example:

This girl left a couch with some roommates when she moved out. About a year later she came back to get it and complained it smelled like cigarettes, beer, and pee etc.

So she sued these two friends of mine who were her former roommates.

She won. Her story was credible, and they didn't cut their hair for court.

well given the item in question is a firearm, OP needs to make sure that the appropriate paperwork was filled out for transfer. You can't just give a gun to someone without them having a license. I am not sure if this rule goes for antiques, but I would make sure you find out OP. All firearms need records of transfer etc.

**Grendelmort**

My guess it would be a "he said, she said" in a court and whoever had possession of the shotgun would most likely win, unless you could produce a receipt for the gun to show you purchased it or show where it was willed to you as part of an estate.

**daisy** lop guest User ID: 48475 08-08-2012 02:56 AM

Luvapottamus Wrote:

You don't need a license or paperwork for a shotgun in most states.

You should have gotten a receipt. But that rarely happens among friends.

The judge in a small claims case isn't gonna weigh gun registration crap anyway, it's a property claim.

If this friend didn't give you anything of value it's not likely their claim it was a gift will pass muster. Depends on the judge and who they believe.

well if that is the case and the friend is not complying with the original deal, I would find someone named Nunzio or Vinny and have a sit down with that friend.... see if an agreement can't be made without having to crack some skulls around.

Cheer

**Foodnipple** · **Foodnipple** ♋ User ID: 113102 08-08-2012 02:57 AM **Posts: 4,849**

Why would you in the first place?

**Luvapottamus**

There's also this:

Go take it, it's yours.

Then they'd have to sue you for it, or call the cops.

That's your call, and cops aren't good arbiters, but if somebody tried to keep tools I loaned them, I'd just go take them back.

**Rod Munch**

circa 12 Wrote:

What if you leave something with someone to keep it safe for a short time and then when you ask for it back they claim "you can't have it because you gave it to them"? When you did no such thing... ?????? WTF.. is that theft or what?

BTW, the item being claimed is an antique spanish shotgun..

Thank You

You will likely have to file a claim against them asking the court to order them to return your property. If you win, you can likely get court costs and attorney fees. Consult a lawyer. He may advise you to file a police report as well.

To strengthen your case, can anyone testify on your behalf to support your claim that you left the property in this person's care but did not give it to the person to keep? In other words, did you tell any family or friends at any point in the past that the person in question was simply holding your property in safe keeping but not not to keep? It would be important that you told your family or friends before the person in question refused to return it.

I believe you. An antique shotgun is not something you just "gift" to someone else, unless it is close family like a son or grandson. Your case is even more compelling if it is true that you only left it with them for a short time before requesting its return.

You should consult with an attorney. It may cost you a little money, but the attorney can likely write a letter to this individual demanding the return of your property. The attorney will also include a brief explanation of your legal claim (should you have to bring one) and the threat of seeking all legal costs associated with bringing such a claim. If the person refuses to return the property after this point and you bring the claim, a court is more likely to award you costs because you warned them and gave them a chance to return it.

I'm not a lawyer...but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Seriously, a letter from a lawyer is probably the easiest and best solution. In any event, it is the first step if you really want your property back without too much effort and stress. Good luck.

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 113369 08-08-2012 03:59 AM

It might be considered Theft by Conversion....the gun came into their hands "legally" but then they essentially stole it by claiming it belongs to them. Not nice!

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionar...conversion

conversion n. a civil wrong (tort) in which one converts another's property to his/her own use, which is a fancy way of saying "steals." Conversion includes treating another's goods as one's own, holding onto such property which accidently comes into the convertor's (taker's) hands, or purposely giving the impression the assets belong to him/her. This gives the true owner the right to sue for his/her own property or the value and loss of use of it, as well as going to law enforcement authorities since conversion usually includes the crime of theft. (See: theft)

**LoP Guest** lop guest User ID: 98922 08-08-2012 04:32 AM

circa 12 Wrote:

What if you leave something with someone to keep it safe for a short time and then when you ask for it back they claim "you can't have it because you gave it to them"? When you did no such thing... ?????? WTF.. is that theft or what?

BTW, the item being claimed is an antique spanish shotgun..

Thank You

You left out one option: dumb. Did you have anything in writing, an agreement, an email maybe, documenting your intention?

Can you prove it is yours? If they can't prove it belongs to them, report the theft and follow-up in court if necessary.

**PsychoticBlonde**

LoP Guest Wrote:

It might be considered Theft by Conversion....the gun came into their hands "legally" but then they essentially stole it by claiming it belongs to them. Not nice!

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionar...conversion

conversion n. a civil wrong (tort) in which one converts another's property to his/her own use, which is a fancy way of saying "steals." Conversion includes treating another's goods as one's own, holding onto such property which accidently comes into the convertor's (taker's) hands, or purposely giving the impression the assets belong to him/her. This gives the true owner the right to sue for his/her own property or the value and loss of use of it, as well as going to law enforcement authorities since conversion usually includes the crime of theft. (See: theft)

Good advice from everyone. Thank you... The conversion sounds like a big possibility. In Colorado you don't have to license a firearm. You can buy and sell without a license too and no reg. is required.

**PsychoticBlonde**

LoP Guest Wrote:

circa 12 Wrote:
What if you leave something with someone to keep it safe for a short time and then when you ask for it back they claim "you can't have it because you gave it to them"? When you did no such thing... ?????? WTF.. is that theft or what?

BTW, the item being claimed is an antique spanish shotgun..

Thank You

You left out one option: dumb. Did you have anything in writing, an agreement, an email maybe, documenting your intention?

Can you prove it is yours? If they can't prove it belongs to them, report the theft and follow-up in court if necessary.

Yes I have witness... I was just wondering how other people saw this, to know if I had grounds before I file it in court.