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What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 87570
06-29-2012 12:58 PM

 



Post: #46
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
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The Lucky AC  Wrote: (06-29-2012 11:02 AM)
Pi  Wrote: (06-29-2012 05:57 AM)
Are you still required to buy it and if you have pre-existing conditions ? If you only make around 12,000 to 13,000 a year? Because By the time I pay rent and my basic bills I have hardly nothing left.

People with incomes at or below 133% of the federal poverty level will be eligible for Medicaid.

^^^For those who make little money, this will really help. ^^^

Also, in 2014, insurance companies will be banned from discriminating against anyone with a pre-existing condition, and from charging higher rates due to gender or health status. In addition to the ban on lifetime dollar limits, insurance companies can no longer impose annual dollar limits on health benefits.
Bottom line- for those of you who can't currently afford healthcare, once the reforms become effective, you will be able to have healthcare AND afford it. Cheer
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Peace Out
Don't mind me, Im lost
User ID: 63168
06-29-2012 01:00 PM

Posts: 2,264



Post: #47
.
.
(This post was last modified: 08-08-2012 09:33 AM by Peace Out.) Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 1725
06-29-2012 02:12 PM

 



Post: #48
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 09:22 AM)
GUANO  Wrote: (06-29-2012 06:53 AM)
Don't worry, they'll make some new and improved Ghettos which are funded by the state in order to ensure you're able to afford Obamacare. You think Renting an apt is bad? At least you have some kind of choice where you live haha... In the New World, they choose for you if you can't afford to choose for yourself... even now the choice is just a facade...

You are correct. That's the "affordable housing" portion of Agenda 21. It's already happening in cities all across the country where these gov't subsidized apartment buildings are being built, funded by HUD. Do some research into your city and you're likely to find them there too.

Good, IMO if the government is paying your way you should live in a barracks style life. They truly needy would appreciate it, the lazy would work their way out of it.
In either case its not fair to hand people who canty care for themselves someone elses money to make choices with. Supply them with food and a roof. No Cash, No vouchers.
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The Evil AC
I am not a number!!!
User ID: 666
06-29-2012 02:42 PM

 



Post: #49
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 02:12 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 09:22 AM)
GUANO  Wrote: (06-29-2012 06:53 AM)
Don't worry, they'll make some new and improved Ghettos which are funded by the state in order to ensure you're able to afford Obamacare. You think Renting an apt is bad? At least you have some kind of choice where you live haha... In the New World, they choose for you if you can't afford to choose for yourself... even now the choice is just a facade...

You are correct. That's the "affordable housing" portion of Agenda 21. It's already happening in cities all across the country where these gov't subsidized apartment buildings are being built, funded by HUD. Do some research into your city and you're likely to find them there too.

Good, IMO if the government is paying your way you should live in a barracks style life. They truly needy would appreciate it, the lazy would work their way out of it.
In either case its not fair to hand people who canty care for themselves someone elses money to make choices with. Supply them with food and a roof. No Cash, No vouchers.

yes, Yes YES,
All for helping out,
but this system is exploited to easily
It needs to change so people have incentive
to better their own lives and stop relying on others
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 40826
06-29-2012 03:19 PM

 



Post: #50
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
Wow.

When you watch the USA from over the pond, it sometimes looks like it's located on a completely different planet...

What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly? It's a perfectly natural thing in Europe, and no-one would have it any other way! Left, right, it doesn't care - leaving sick people to die without care just isn't on the political agenda here!

But Americans will scream bloody murder if their oh-so precious "freedom" is threatened (the freedom to not care about others that is).

Taking care of your fellow man isn't even a modern socialist invention. Even stone age man could feel empathy. Stone age skeletons have been found, from people that died from old age, in spite of having been born with crippling diseases that would have prevented them from EVER having cared for themselves.

But Americans just can't bring themselves to the same level of civilized behavior the stone age people could...

Frankly, you guys sicken me!

But hey, what do I know, I'm just a European commie bastard trying to steal your freedom...

Don't get all pissy.

The problem with America is they are trying to socialize a FOR PROFIT system.
The people most in a position to fund their socialist dreams on the one hand, are the very people (corporations), who can avoid paying taxes altogether.
You would have to live here to understand the resentment of a system
foisted where people make a modest income that is already barely getting by, will be asked to subsidize a for profit health care system for illegals who pay nothing into it. For the forever and newly found unemployed.
Now you might think buying insurance is a panacea. That now they have a system like yours in Europe. But, no. Because of the profit underbase to healthcare here, even those with Insurance will still be presented with a large bill from Drs., Hospitals, Anesthesiologist, Labs,
etc., etc., that you know, your poorhouse making insurance premiums just didn't cover.

It's the same game we see all the time here. Socialize expenses for private profit.
Nobody minds taking care of elderly.
Unless they are the elderly who spent their whole life having kids for a living. To get food stamps, free health care, free housing, free spending money.

Our healthcare system should either be socialized completely, at no profit to the system, or it should be for profit where if you can afford it, you get care and if you can't, tough luck, or be an alternative medicine
and naturopathic care user.

It's the maddening half and half that is what people complain about.

Imagine if your system were thus set up? You don't get a bill at the end because you paid in.
Here you pay into the sytem, just like you do, and STILL get a bill.
This is the ultimate cash cow because people want to live.
The sick are seen as the ideal consumer. You scare them, get them to agree to dozens of expensive tests and really run up that bill to make as
large a profit off these sick customers as possible.
That's how the patients are viewed. As merely customers.
Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 90891
06-29-2012 03:36 PM

 



Post: #51
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 06:12 AM)
That's okay, I'm sure the Government will set you up on a monthly payment plan and you'll owe your soul to the company store for the rest of your life.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIfu2A0ezq0
yeah with irs becoming the largest finance company in the world cant afford the payments these debt collectors can put ya in da pokey.Jptdknpa
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 40826
06-29-2012 03:39 PM

 



Post: #52
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 03:36 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 06:12 AM)
That's okay, I'm sure the Government will set you up on a monthly payment plan and you'll owe your soul to the company store for the rest of your life.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIfu2A0ezq0
yeah with irs becoming the largest finance company in the world cant afford the payments these debt collectors can put ya in da pokey.Jptdknpa

Which conveniently enough has been made into yet another FOR PROFIT
company.
Ain't American Style Capitalism Great?
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 89915
06-29-2012 03:49 PM

 



Post: #53
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 03:19 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
Wow.

When you watch the USA from over the pond, it sometimes looks like it's located on a completely different planet...

What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly? It's a perfectly natural thing in Europe, and no-one would have it any other way! Left, right, it doesn't care - leaving sick people to die without care just isn't on the political agenda here!

But Americans will scream bloody murder if their oh-so precious "freedom" is threatened (the freedom to not care about others that is).

Taking care of your fellow man isn't even a modern socialist invention. Even stone age man could feel empathy. Stone age skeletons have been found, from people that died from old age, in spite of having been born with crippling diseases that would have prevented them from EVER having cared for themselves.

But Americans just can't bring themselves to the same level of civilized behavior the stone age people could...

Frankly, you guys sicken me!

But hey, what do I know, I'm just a European commie bastard trying to steal your freedom...

Don't get all pissy.

The problem with America is they are trying to socialize a FOR PROFIT system.
The people most in a position to fund their socialist dreams on the one hand, are the very people (corporations), who can avoid paying taxes altogether.
You would have to live here to understand the resentment of a system
foisted where people make a modest income that is already barely getting by, will be asked to subsidize a for profit health care system for illegals who pay nothing into it. For the forever and newly found unemployed.
Now you might think buying insurance is a panacea. That now they have a system like yours in Europe. But, no. Because of the profit underbase to healthcare here, even those with Insurance will still be presented with a large bill from Drs., Hospitals, Anesthesiologist, Labs,
etc., etc., that you know, your poorhouse making insurance premiums just didn't cover.

It's the same game we see all the time here. Socialize expenses for private profit.
Nobody minds taking care of elderly.
Unless they are the elderly who spent their whole life having kids for a living. To get food stamps, free health care, free housing, free spending money.

Our healthcare system should either be socialized completely, at no profit to the system, or it should be for profit where if you can afford it, you get care and if you can't, tough luck, or be an alternative medicine
and naturopathic care user.

It's the maddening half and half that is what people complain about.

Imagine if your system were thus set up? You don't get a bill at the end because you paid in.
Here you pay into the sytem, just like you do, and STILL get a bill.
This is the ultimate cash cow because people want to live.
The sick are seen as the ideal consumer. You scare them, get them to agree to dozens of expensive tests and really run up that bill to make as
large a profit off these sick customers as possible.
That's how the patients are viewed. As merely customers.




^^^^^^the most rational and articulate breakdown I've read.

Thank you.
Quote this message in a reply
Bob
Registered User
User ID: 105402
06-29-2012 03:53 PM

Posts: 984



Post: #54
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
WASHINGTON (WLS) - Beginning in 2014, if you are uninsured, not exempt from the new mandate, and refuse to sign up for health care coverage, how much will you owe Uncle Sam?

The health care law sets out a formula to determine your penalty, which will be assessed and collected by the IRS as part of your federal income taxes.

The penalty will be the greater of a flat dollar amount per person or a percentage of your taxable income. For dependents under 18, the penalty is half the individual amount.

The annual penalty is capped at an amount roughly equal to the cost of the national average premium for a qualified health plan — in other words you cannot be forced to pay more than it would have cost to buy a plan in the first place.

Flat dollar amount for individuals: $95 in 2014; $325 in 2015; and $695 in 2016; increases indexed to inflation after that, subject to a cap.

For example, courtesy Blue Cross Blue Shield: An uninsured family of three (two parents and one child under 18), not exempt from the mandate, would have a flat dollar penalty of $1,737 in 2016.

Percentage of individual taxable income: fixed percentage of household income in excess of tax filing threshold – 1% in 2014; 2% in 2015; 2.5% in 2016.

For example (again courtesy Blue Cross Blue Shield): An uninsured, non-exempt individual with household income of $50,000 would be forced to pay 1 percent of the difference between $50,000 and the tax threshold (let’s say $10,00 for an individual in 2014), or roughly $400. Since $400 is greater than $95, this individual would have to pay $400.

There are plenty of exemptions from the penalty. You do not face it if your insurance premiums would be more than 8 percent of your gross income, if you’re a member of an American Indian tribe, or if you lacked insurance for less than three months during a year.

The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office projects that 4 million uninsured, non-exempt Americans will refuse to get medical coverage and face the penalty in 2016.
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The Evil AC
I am not a number!!!
User ID: 666
06-29-2012 03:55 PM

 



Post: #55
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
Malpractice  Wrote: (06-29-2012 03:53 PM)
The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office projects that 4 million uninsured, non-exempt Americans will refuse to get medical coverage and face the penalty in 2016.

Oh yeah they are counting on it as a source of income
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 40826
06-29-2012 04:02 PM

 



Post: #56
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 03:49 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 03:19 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
Wow.

When you watch the USA from over the pond, it sometimes looks like it's located on a completely different planet...

What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly? It's a perfectly natural thing in Europe, and no-one would have it any other way! Left, right, it doesn't care - leaving sick people to die without care just isn't on the political agenda here!

But Americans will scream bloody murder if their oh-so precious "freedom" is threatened (the freedom to not care about others that is).

Taking care of your fellow man isn't even a modern socialist invention. Even stone age man could feel empathy. Stone age skeletons have been found, from people that died from old age, in spite of having been born with crippling diseases that would have prevented them from EVER having cared for themselves.

But Americans just can't bring themselves to the same level of civilized behavior the stone age people could...

Frankly, you guys sicken me!

But hey, what do I know, I'm just a European commie bastard trying to steal your freedom...

Don't get all pissy.

The problem with America is they are trying to socialize a FOR PROFIT system.
The people most in a position to fund their socialist dreams on the one hand, are the very people (corporations), who can avoid paying taxes altogether.
You would have to live here to understand the resentment of a system
foisted where people make a modest income that is already barely getting by, will be asked to subsidize a for profit health care system for illegals who pay nothing into it. For the forever and newly found unemployed.
Now you might think buying insurance is a panacea. That now they have a system like yours in Europe. But, no. Because of the profit underbase to healthcare here, even those with Insurance will still be presented with a large bill from Drs., Hospitals, Anesthesiologist, Labs,
etc., etc., that you know, your poorhouse making insurance premiums just didn't cover.

It's the same game we see all the time here. Socialize expenses for private profit.
Nobody minds taking care of elderly.
Unless they are the elderly who spent their whole life having kids for a living. To get food stamps, free health care, free housing, free spending money.

Our healthcare system should either be socialized completely, at no profit to the system, or it should be for profit where if you can afford it, you get care and if you can't, tough luck, or be an alternative medicine
and naturopathic care user.

It's the maddening half and half that is what people complain about.

Imagine if your system were thus set up? You don't get a bill at the end because you paid in.
Here you pay into the sytem, just like you do, and STILL get a bill.
This is the ultimate cash cow because people want to live.
The sick are seen as the ideal consumer. You scare them, get them to agree to dozens of expensive tests and really run up that bill to make as
large a profit off these sick customers as possible.
That's how the patients are viewed. As merely customers.




^^^^^^the most rational and articulate breakdown I've read.

Thank you.

Your welcome.
This is a camel who's nose they don't REALLY want getting under the tent.
They do not want to take away the profit motive for ANYTHING, thus being called a socialist government or communist.
They must remain "capitalist", while instituting socialist program after socialist program.

See here's the problem they'd run into with a quickness if they tried to go all out socializing medicine.
They'd have Doctors and Hospitals and the staff being on a set fee to keep the expenses at level with the insurance premiums payment. or a government set medicaid or medicare fee.
Doctors would no longer have an incentive to serve at hospitals and would not serve hospitals because they have enormous tuition loans to repay because the schools and education have not been socialized.
They remain for profit.
So now they need to fund the education system under a socialized system to eliminate the loan burden to get Doctors to work in Hospitals again.

It's the House that Jack built kind of story.
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Bob
Registered User
User ID: 105402
06-29-2012 04:25 PM

Posts: 984



Post: #57
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
Forgot my username  Wrote: (06-29-2012 08:14 AM)
I'll go ahead and let them send me to jail. Thanks.

Im sure they would be more than happy to support the 74 billion dollar private prison industry.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 98922
06-29-2012 04:48 PM

 



Post: #58
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly?

This is America, where a huge percentage of the sick are deliberately self induced sick.

Tell me, you don't mind paying for someone else's consequences? You don't mind paying huge amounts for the smokers, the gorging obese, the STD infested immoral crowd, the lazy diabetics that ate themselves into this condition, those with weak hearts because they never exercise, the drunken druggy addicts, etc?

Nobody should be made to pay for the consequences of another persons personal life choices. You people that think otherwise are asses. Leave others alone, everyone else is not here to pay for or to suffer YOUR consequences.

Yeah I'll help those who legitimately need help because of no fault of their own, but to hell with the idiots that would want to enslave me to pay for their self induced consequences.

Some people are just darn stupid and evil and would enslave the world if they could.
Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 4158
06-29-2012 05:00 PM

 



Post: #59
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 04:48 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly?

This is America, where a huge percentage of the sick are deliberately self induced sick.

Tell me, you don't mind paying for someone else's consequences? You don't mind paying huge amounts for the smokers, the gorging obese, the STD infested immoral crowd, the lazy diabetics that ate themselves into this condition, those with weak hearts because they never exercise, the drunken druggy addicts, etc?

Nobody should be made to pay for the consequences of another persons personal life choices. You people that think otherwise are asses. Leave others alone, everyone else is not here to pay for or to suffer YOUR consequences.

Yeah I'll help those who legitimately need help because of no fault of their own, but to hell with the idiots that would want to enslave me to pay for their self induced consequences.

Some people are just darn stupid and evil and would enslave the world if they could.

You're a stupid f*cking very sexy lady. You are a stupid f*cking twit. Did I say you are stupid. Yes, you are f*cking stupid.

If you believe that the only people who contributed something to this world were little goodmorning america clean type yuppies, you are SADLY f*cking MISTAKEN and need to revisit your theories of how the world works.
Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 40826
06-29-2012 05:13 PM

 



Post: #60
RE: What if you can not afford Obama Care? Say you only make around 11 to 13 thousand/yr
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 04:48 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-29-2012 12:30 PM)
What's so horrible about a society taking care of the sick and elderly?

This is America, where a huge percentage of the sick are deliberately self induced sick.

Tell me, you don't mind paying for someone else's consequences? You don't mind paying huge amounts for the smokers, the gorging obese, the STD infested immoral crowd, the lazy diabetics that ate themselves into this condition, those with weak hearts because they never exercise, the drunken druggy addicts, etc?

Nobody should be made to pay for the consequences of another persons personal life choices. You people that think otherwise are asses. Leave others alone, everyone else is not here to pay for or to suffer YOUR consequences.

Yeah I'll help those who legitimately need help because of no fault of their own, but to hell with the idiots that would want to enslave me to pay for their self induced consequences.

Some people are just darn stupid and evil and would enslave the world if they could.

As a thought experiment, I like to imagine the world without a Federal Government.
Just a territorial government, so to speak.

People would naturally subdivide themselves as they do now in large cities. Poor and drug infested slums are created by it's own inhabitants.
But, the slum lords would not be allowed.
They would just squat in their area. Allowed the "freedom" to descend into the lowest depths they desire with no one to intervene yea or nay.
But, this too, is a "gated community".
You could leave if you gave up the lifestyle for the next choice of community that would accept you. Or enter from one of the others if you so chose.

Another area would be the farm territory gated community. Where the middle subbies would go from time to time to buy supplies to take back to their hives
of suburbia where they live and work at companies, but with a few trappings of "wealth" back to their respective gated commmunity.

Each group would jointly fund the healthcare, law enforcement and services, individually or collectively, as decided by that particular community.

This is how I envision society would arrange itself if given complete freedom to do so.

Not really suited to the topic, but just what came to mind spurred by your post.
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