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Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 496878
04-15-2019 12:04 PM

 



Post: #31
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
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LoP Guest  Wrote: (04-15-2019 11:23 AM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (04-15-2019 11:05 AM)
Well here is how it could work. In 2035 Germany has no nuclear power plants and is preparing to shut its last coal power stations to reach its 2040 deadline. It has lots of renewable power capacity but depends on the weather for that. Russia is unhappy about some political move Germany has made and announces it will temporarily shut down NS 1 and NS2 in January and February, taking a serious but non-fatal financial hit. Germany is plunged into chaos and darkness. Industry grinds to a halt and people start freezing and starving in the dark. How long could Germany hold out vs how long could Russia hold out? Germany could never really risk NS1 & 2 shutting whearas Russia could ride out a short term loss of revenue, it has easily survived the long term sanctions over Crimea. This is the risky situation Germany is looking to put itself in, to be at the mercy of Russia's energy policy.

If we right now can handle Venezuela and Iran and Libya going offline, all major EU energy suppliers, then we can handle Russia too.
They are global oil producers. You can buy oil cargoes from anywhere and at any one time there is a huge floating buffer of supertankers at sea that can go where the demand requires them to. Piped gas is different, gas needs to be supplied continously. Germany does have Europe's largest gas storage facility but in a future Germany, more relaint on gas this would not hold out for long. Without Nord stream German power stations would go offline in a matter of days and gas for heating would stop too, it would be apocalyptic in mid winter.

On March the 1st last year due to minor gas supply restrictions and cooler weather the UK electricity wholesale electricity price went from around £45 /MWh to £1000 MWh. This despite the fact that UK produces its own gas, imports from Norway and Netherlands by pipeline and LNG by ship and has plenty of coal, wind and nuclear power.

https://www.electricinsights.co.uk/#/das...&_k=vreswt

That's how sensitive power production is to restrictions in gas supply.

Quote:But if it turns out Russia is so unreliable, I'm sure we will make sure we are not critically dependent on NS.

Lets hope German politicians are as sensible as you are.
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The Obamanation
Registered User
User ID: 397180
04-15-2019 01:30 PM

Posts: 1,815



Post: #32
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
The USA should leave NATO.

Europe is committing suicide and Russia is no longer a grave threat to the world. That's what NATO's intended purpose is - to resist Russia.

The biggest threats to the world today are islam and China.

We don't need these half-dead allies in Europe who don't want to pull their own weight, to mount a united front against yesteryear's enemy.

[Image: 35589702332_7c753b8a42_n.jpg]
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 442059
04-15-2019 02:23 PM

 



Post: #33
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
The Obamanation  Wrote: (04-15-2019 01:30 PM)
The USA should leave NATO.

Europe is committing suicide and Russia is no longer a grave threat to the world. That's what NATO's intended purpose is - to resist Russia.

The biggest threats to the world today are islam and China.

We don't need these half-dead allies in Europe who don't want to pull their own weight, to mount a united front against yesteryear's enemy.

Let us (europe) pay for Libya, cos I think that was mostly initiated by France.
But the US can pay for Afghanistan, Iraq, most of Syria and the Ukraine thing.
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44575
Registered User
User ID: 493119
04-15-2019 04:20 PM

Posts: 2,783



Post: #34
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
ahemm, topic here is "Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO" - not Russia and NordStream 2.

I have no detailled insight in Germanys military spending - but if i think about more weapons to import from Donaldistan then i have to say: look at Turkey !

... and if you add to the stated 1,2 % ALL the economic losses due Donalds sanctions then Germany pays over 2 % ...

Dont forget : Germany hasnt "joined" into sanctioning Russia - these sanctions are pressed on Germany by Donaldistan !

... and in an earlyer thread i showed : NATO (alliance) solidarity clause is based on article 5 but NOT on article F-35

NATO solidarity clause is called Article 5, not article F-35’
http://lunaticoutpost.com/thread-115949.html

so, and now PLEASE begin to think for yourself how much longer Germany can be pressed to do what the dictatorial hard core of Donaldistan orders ?

[Image: giU0MBk.jpg]
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engineering
Persuade, Change, Influence
User ID: 496754
04-15-2019 04:44 PM

Posts: 3,091



Post: #35
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
The Obamanation  Wrote: (04-15-2019 01:30 PM)
The USA should leave NATO.

Europe is committing suicide and Russia is no longer a grave threat to the world. That's what NATO's intended purpose is - to resist Russia.

The biggest threats to the world today are islam and China.

We don't need these half-dead allies in Europe who don't want to pull their own weight, to mount a united front against yesteryear's enemy.

Do you know Russia funds African warlords, backs Iranian terrorists, many captured ISIS leaders were previously in the Russian military, the guy leading the Libyan takeovers entire military force was bought & trained by Russia, eastern Ukraine was destroyed by Russia, all the cities in Syria were bombed to ruins by Russia, all the refugees from the chaos & destruction caused by Russian actions ended up in Europe. Russia will not admit any refugees that it created forcing them into Europe.
Those countries in Europe being taken over by Islam are at the mercy of Russia who controls the flow of migrants.
Didn't you ever think it was odd that those who support Russia blame jews as much as they do for everything? They blamed jews for all the immigrants like it's part of some secret jew plan to takeover the world. Reality is Russia is behind them.
[Image: Isuyz1M.png]
https://www.belfercenter.org/publication...weapon-war

Russia’s real designs in Libya
Moscow’s objective, it is claimed, is to control of the Libyan coast and, with it, control of the main clandestine migration routes.

If you stop falling for Russian lies from internet trolls who spend all day blaming jews for everything you could see how Russia is using immigrants as weapons to tear apart European nations.
And not just that but they are actively preparing their military for war.
I remember Obama saying Russia is no threat either but that's really no surprise they were selling them our uranium, working with Iran, plotting everything even attempting the take down of Trump which he could even be in on himself that's how bad the situation is.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 442059
04-15-2019 04:49 PM

 



Post: #36
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
When was last time Germany was attacked and US helped in her defense then?
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 397180
04-15-2019 04:50 PM

 



Post: #37
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
engineering  Wrote: (04-15-2019 04:44 PM)
The Obamanation  Wrote: (04-15-2019 01:30 PM)
The USA should leave NATO.

Europe is committing suicide and Russia is no longer a grave threat to the world. That's what NATO's intended purpose is - to resist Russia.

The biggest threats to the world today are islam and China.

We don't need these half-dead allies in Europe who don't want to pull their own weight, to mount a united front against yesteryear's enemy.

Do you know Russia funds African warlords, backs Iranian terrorists, many captured ISIS leaders were previously in the Russian military, the guy leading the Libyan takeovers entire military force was bought & trained by Russia, eastern Ukraine was destroyed by Russia, all the cities in Syria were bombed to ruins by Russia, all the refugees from the chaos & destruction caused by Russian actions ended up in Europe. Russia will not admit any refugees that it created forcing them into Europe.
Those countries in Europe being taken over by Islam are at the mercy of Russia who controls the flow of migrants.
Didn't you ever think it was odd that those who support Russia blame jews as much as they do for everything? They blamed jews for all the immigrants like it's part of some secret jew plan to takeover the world. Reality is Russia is behind them.
link to image: https://i.imgur.com/Isuyz1M.png
https://www.belfercenter.org/publication...weapon-war

Russia’s real designs in Libya
Moscow’s objective, it is claimed, is to control of the Libyan coast and, with it, control of the main clandestine migration routes.

If you stop falling for Russian lies from internet trolls who spend all day blaming jews for everything you could see how Russia is using immigrants as weapons to tear apart European nations.
And not just that but they are actively preparing their military for war.
I remember Obama saying Russia is no threat either but that's really no surprise they were selling them our uranium, working with Iran, plotting everything even attempting the take down of Trump which he could even be in on himself that's how bad the situation is.

Let's say Russia is responsible for the mass migration.

So why are all our supposed allies letting them in and falling for Russia's evil plan?

Sorry but the end result is still the same. We should pull out of NATO. We have no use for Europe because it's willingly become a third world shithole that can't defend itself, let alone contribute in any meaningful way to WW3, which is what would happen if we actually went to war with Russia.

If they can't protect their own borders from unarmed migrants how are they supposed to resist Russia?

I still don't blame Russia for it. I think you're trying to cast Russia as a scapegoat.

Europe is leftist and I blame the weak-willed liberals who have their head in the clouds and think the world is all cotton candy clouds and rainbow unicorn farts. They think all the raping and pillaging is a good thing. Let's let in more immigrants! muslims aren't our enemies!

Europe is to blame for Europe committing suicide. The USA should leave NATO. It no longer serves a useful purpose.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 442059
04-15-2019 04:51 PM

 



Post: #38
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
Blaming Jews or blaming Russia, when it really is your own country that is doing most of it. Is the same thing to me,
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 497344
04-15-2019 04:57 PM

 



Post: #39
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
44575  Wrote: (04-15-2019 04:20 PM)
ahemm, topic here is "Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO" - not Russia and NordStream 2.

I have no detailled insight in Germanys military spending - but if i think about more weapons to import from Donaldistan then i have to say: look at Turkey !

... and if you add to the stated 1,2 % ALL the economic losses due Donalds sanctions then Germany pays over 2 % ...

Dont forget : Germany hasnt "joined" into sanctioning Russia - these sanctions are pressed on Germany by Donaldistan !

... and in an earlyer thread i showed : NATO (alliance) solidarity clause is based on article 5 but NOT on article F-35

NATO solidarity clause is called Article 5, not article F-35’
http://lunaticoutpost.com/thread-115949.html

so, and now PLEASE begin to think for yourself how much longer Germany can be pressed to do what the dictatorial hard core of Donaldistan orders ?

How is Germany going to make a European Army work if it does not spend the cash to match the other members, it is not just about NATO, Merkels mini me replacement wants the French UN Security seat while suggesting it replaces the likes of the UK and France as the voice of Europe..

How on earth is Germany going to stand in their stead but not spend any cash in relation to the others on the council, US, Russia or China.... not exactly going to be listened to by those who only listen to hard power... they'll just laugh.

Do you honestly think the UK spends money on defence just for the US? the Northern Alliance between Britain/Nordics/Baltics sits outside NATO or EU remit, France and Britain have combined joined forces that too sits outside the remit of NATO and the EU... how is Germany going to partner with those countries if it does not spend the cash...

When all said and done, if Germany does not pull it's own weight in a European context then France will dominate any European military and will dominate the military base/action of the EU as a whole which in time will include them directing what are now German forces where ever they want...

And as a point, What percentage of German military kit is made in the US??? are the ships made in the US? are the tanks?

The whole Article 5 not F35 is sheer spin and nonsense... how many actual military aircraft has Germany got that where made in the US? what is, a total of 4 on order, wow, Germany certainly seems under pressure to buy American kit/not, France has brought more US kit than Germany and relies on the UK for heavy lift since no one else in Europe has such heavy lift.....

the whole thing is total missdirection Germany does not buy US kit in the first place and hasn't for some time and is not going to in the near future, the replacement for the Typhoon is the FCAS not the F35... that is only if Germany puts it's hands in it's pockets and spends the cash...

Italian think tanks are already advising the Italian gov to join the UKs Tempest program and not the Franco-German FCAS as they'll get a say in the Tempest Program where they'll have to defer to France as a much more junior partner if they joined the FCAS program...
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 442059
04-15-2019 05:00 PM

 



Post: #40
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
Both the left and the right somehow seem to think we need migrants cos we are aging.

I guess these theories come from worldbank and IMF.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 465738
04-15-2019 05:32 PM

 



Post: #41
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
Ich been ein free rider.
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The Obamanation
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User ID: 397180
04-15-2019 05:36 PM

Posts: 1,815



Post: #42
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
LoP Guest  Wrote: (04-15-2019 05:00 PM)
Both the left and the right somehow seem to think we need migrants cos we are aging.

I guess these theories come from worldbank and IMF.

I don't know any right-wingers who want more immigration.

This is something the elite want for some reason and it's something that will only end up hurting everyone.

[Image: 35589702332_7c753b8a42_n.jpg]
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 497344
04-15-2019 06:29 PM

 



Post: #43
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
The Obamanation  Wrote: (04-15-2019 05:36 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (04-15-2019 05:00 PM)
Both the left and the right somehow seem to think we need migrants cos we are aging.

I guess these theories come from worldbank and IMF.

I don't know any right-wingers who want more immigration.

This is something the elite want for some reason and it's something that will only end up hurting everyone.

the argument has often been made that the left want it for diversity and the right want it for profits (ie drive down the cost of profits) however these seems like excuses to blame each side rather than delve into what could be happening..

there was a liberal thinker and liberal icon at the turn of the 20th century who suggested that socialism and capitalism would not fight to the death as some suspect but would rather merge and through socialist reforms of capitalism would remove it's freedoms and through over regulation would create a new form of slavery.. (Hillaire Belloc MP, The servile state published in 1910)
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singing spider
krautistan terrarist
User ID: 497623
04-15-2019 08:53 PM

Posts: 8,462



Post: #44
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
you want us to pay for this?
http://lunaticoutpost.com/thread-114783.html

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arachnophobes beware!
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 397180
04-15-2019 09:03 PM

 



Post: #45
RE: Germany makes more excuses about not ponying up to 2% of GDP for NATO
singing spider  Wrote: (04-15-2019 08:53 PM)
you want us to pay for this?
http://lunaticoutpost.com/thread-114783.html

We should take all our toys and leave.

No more bases in NATO allied countries.
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