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ʻOumuamua Anyone?
BlackCat
Every day is an extra day
User ID: 367222
01-22-2021 10:48 PM

Posts: 12,584




Post: #46
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
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longpig  Wrote: (01-22-2021 10:38 PM)
BlackCat  Wrote: (01-22-2021 10:08 PM)
Totally, if you try to hit a target many thousands of years in the future, your calculations better be very, very precise.

Yes, that, and the fact that they may be masters of time. But we digress.

It is the speed of the object that is remarkable. 196,000 miles per hour (87.3 kilometers per second)

It was already hot incoming. We just added velocity. The asteroid travels about 500 million miles per year. So fascinating.

Titbit: It also almost certainly came from our galaxy.

https://www.projectpluto.com/temp/2017u1.htm

Further:

Most likely, A/2017 U1 was created in the early stages of planet formation around another star. It's estimated that 99% of the material around the Sun when it formed got thrown out into interstellar space, and much of it is probably still roaming the galaxy. I would expect your average interstellar object to be billions of years old, which would mean it came from very far away.

Vaste distances and great speeds. Strange trajectories. High reflectivity. Dense metallic structure.

Did they perhaps miscalculate. Did they miss us? Perhaps the softener before the punch.

Perhaps a warning shot for those in the know.

Then there is talk, where once were whispers, of Niburu.

I think the name 'Scout' is appropriate and not just happenstance.

I am not a cat.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 204121
01-23-2021 12:14 AM

 




Post: #47
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
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Sing-I'llSway
Equal Opportunity Skeptic
User ID: 575251
01-23-2021 12:36 AM

Posts: 5,705




Post: #48
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
longpig  Wrote: (01-22-2021 06:19 PM)
ʻOumuamua is the first known interstellar object detected passing through the Solar System. Formally designated 1I/2017 U1, it was discovered by Robert Weryk using the Pan-STARRS telescope at Haleakalā Observatory, Hawaii, on 19 October 2017, 40 days after it passed its closest point to the Sun on 9 September. When it was first observed, it was about 33 million km (21 million mi; 0.22 AU) from Earth (about 85 times as far away as the Moon), and already heading away from the Sun.

In July 2019, astronomers reported that ʻOumuamua was a natural object. This came after speculation of ʻOumuamua being an alien object.

The name comes from Hawaiian ʻoumuamua 'scout'.

ʻOumuamua appears to have come from roughly the direction of Vega in the constellation Lyra.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CA%BBOumuamua

Harvard astronomer says alien technology visited in 2017, may have been distant civilization’s trash.

https://www.rt.com/news/511432-alien-tec...-oumuamua/

[Image: 7I84fhW.jpg]


I literally fell asleep listening to this podcast last night:









I love proper astronomy, and this ^^^^^ is about as close to woo as I get.


Whether or not the object (I'm not even going to try spelling it) IS "alien" in nature I honestly cannot say.

It's a sincerely fascinating discussion though.

“Allegations that find favor in the public sphere of gossip & innuendo cannot be a substitute for procedure in federal court. Plaintiffs have not moved the needle for their fraud theory from conceivable to plausible, which they must do to state a claim under Federal pleading standards.”
-US District Judge Diane Humetewa, decimating Trump's lies
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Sing-I'llSway
Equal Opportunity Skeptic
User ID: 575251
01-23-2021 12:40 AM

Posts: 5,705




Post: #49
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
For what it's worth, my personal opinion, more and more everyday, is that there is no intelligent life anywhere else in the observable universe besides...here.


I think simple microbial life is likely common enough. Europa, Jupiter's moon, for instance, very likely has a subsurface ocean containing....various "critters".

But none of them are using iphones.

I just personally feel the parameters necessary for life to have a chance to evolve to the point people are walking around with iphones are so unlikely it's probably never happened anywhere but here.

But who knows.

“Allegations that find favor in the public sphere of gossip & innuendo cannot be a substitute for procedure in federal court. Plaintiffs have not moved the needle for their fraud theory from conceivable to plausible, which they must do to state a claim under Federal pleading standards.”
-US District Judge Diane Humetewa, decimating Trump's lies
Quote this message in a reply
NormalIsSubjective

User ID: 573345
01-23-2021 12:59 AM

Posts: 17,331




Post: #50
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Sing-IllSway  Wrote: (01-23-2021 12:40 AM)
For what it's worth, my personal opinion, more and more everyday, is that there is no intelligent life anywhere else in the observable universe besides...here.


I think simple microbial life is likely common enough. Europa, Jupiter's moon, for instance, very likely has a subsurface ocean containing....various "critters".

But none of them are using iphones.

I just personally feel the parameters necessary for life to have a chance to evolve to the point people are walking around with iphones are so unlikely it's probably never happened anywhere but here.

But who knows.


"parameters", such as?
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Xor
Registered User
User ID: 574651
01-23-2021 01:22 AM

Posts: 4




Post: #51
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
LoP Guest  Wrote: (01-22-2021 06:55 PM)
The thing to consider is the oumuamua is basically identical to the spaceship found on the dark side of the moon.

It's not there anymore, I ran out of helium 3 and had to park it, until I could collect more.
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Sing-I'llSway
Equal Opportunity Skeptic
User ID: 575251
01-23-2021 02:07 AM

Posts: 5,705




Post: #52
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
NormalIsSubjective  Wrote: (01-23-2021 12:59 AM)
Sing-IllSway  Wrote: (01-23-2021 12:40 AM)
For what it's worth, my personal opinion, more and more everyday, is that there is no intelligent life anywhere else in the observable universe besides...here.


I think simple microbial life is likely common enough. Europa, Jupiter's moon, for instance, very likely has a subsurface ocean containing....various "critters".

But none of them are using iphones.

I just personally feel the parameters necessary for life to have a chance to evolve to the point people are walking around with iphones are so unlikely it's probably never happened anywhere but here.

But who knows.


"parameters", such as?

Sure. Basically, the more I learn and watch and read, the more I've just been blown away by HOW MANY variables had to fall into place for us to evolve long enough to "get smart".

For instance, our position within the Milky Way itself.
We are located within a VERY favorable "neighborhood" of the galaxy.

We're far back (about halfway back to the edge) from the core. This is good news because the core is a hellscape of HIGHLY-ionizing radiation from countless black holes, neutron stars, magnetars, etc all crowded together.

We're located in an outgrowth of the Orion Arm, sometimes called a "spur", which is safely far away from any objects that could harm us, such as massive stars that could explode as supernovae.

Our region of the Orion Spur is also a particularly low-density area. It's sometimes called "The Local Bubble". The bubble was likely blown out by the ancient supernova that contributed to our Sun's birth (by compressing a nearby molecular cloud.)

As a result, there are no stars nearby enough to disrupt our Oort Cloud, a cloud of comets surrounding the Sun in a sphere. Passing stars could perturb those comets, and send them hurtling towards the inner solar system. Certain extinction level events are postulated to have happened this way, if I remember correctly.

So we're safely isolated in a reasonably quiet region of the Milky Way. For this, we're lucky.




Our Sun is not a binary (IT MIGHT BE; there's legit research going into whether there's a "dark companion" out beyond Neptune, but nothing hazardous to the point I'm about to explain.)

Planets can form and "survive" in binary systems, but they're not terribly stable. And there's no guarantee they won't be inevitably kicked out of the system via gravitational perturbation.

It's much better for us that the Sun is a solo act (or at least does not have a SIGNIFICANT companion.)





Our Sun is a very well-behaved, mild-mannered middle-aged star that will not explode on us.
Furthermore, it's not a flare star (many are, such as our closest neighbor, Proxima Centauri), which would surely prevent us from evolving to high intelligence.

For five billion years our Sun has basically just done its thing, remaining quite consistent (it has its 10-yearish cycles, but that's no threat to civilization.) This enabled us to evolve.

As a yellow dwarf, the Sun has provided us with none of the problems many other stars do.

For instance, Red dwarves (which Proxima Centauri is) are the most common star-type in the universe, and they tend to be chaotic, dangerous flare stars.

Blue stars tend to be giant monsters who burn through their nuclear fuel and go supernova sometimes in only millions of years, which is not nearly long enough for any species to evolve to high intelligence.

Our Sun is a mild-mannered yellow dwarf, and we continue to benefit from that to this day.





We have a Jupiter.
It's not commonly known, but we really do owe our civilization to Jupiter. As the most massive object besides the Sun in our solar system, its gravity well is VERY deep, and as a result it has "captured" countless "moons" over billions of years that would otherwise have certainly bashed into Earth.

It's not hyperbole to refer to Jupiter as a "guardian angel".

We're lucky to have it.






We have our Moon.
First, the creation of the moon (LIKELY in a collision with a "Mars-sized object" billions of years ago) resulted in our slight axial tilt, which results in our seasons.

Those seasons are solidified by the gravitational force of the moon.

This matters because it resulted in predictable seasons. Agriculture was able to develop because our ancestors caught on to the patterns of the seasons. And they could DEPEND on the seasons.

And you can't have civilization without agriculture.

Without the stabilizing force of our moon, the seasons would be chaotic and literally unpredictable. It would be similar to the seasons portrayed in "Game of Thrones".

We're very, very lucky to have the moon we do. There would likely be no civilization without it.






Of course, we are in the "goldilocks" region of our solar system, which is the orbital area within which water won't freeze uncontrollably or evaporate uncontrollably.

But even being in the "goldilocks" region didn't guarantee us anything. Just ask Venus (God knows what happened there...).





All of these randoms things, and more (this is just what I thought up off the top of my head sitting here) have to fall into place for stability to last long enough on Earth for us to evolve into "smart" individuals.


We have to be safely far back from the galactic core.
We have to safely far back from any potential supernovae.
We have to safely far back from the influence of any nearby nebulae giving off harmful radiation.
We have to be NOT in a hazardous binary star system.
We need a Moon.
We need a collision early in our history to arrange our axial tilt.
We need a well-behaved star that won't blow up on us, or sterilize the planet with periodic powerful flares.
We need a Jupiter.
We need to be in a solar system that isn't crowded with debris that can regularly smash into us.
We need to be in the "goldilocks" zone.
We need to not turn into Venus.
We need to have our Oort Cloud NOT be perturbed regularly by any nearby neighbors.


The universe is just SO hostile to anything alive. It's SO treacherous. And if just one of the above listed things doesn't fall into place, catastrophe occurs and humanity never evolves into "intelligence".

The facts about our moon and its formation particularly blow my mind. Just an INCREDIBLY fortuitous event.

I mean, there COULD BE some United Federation of Planets out there. Who knows. I would actually love that.

I just personally find it profoundly unlikely

I really do believe we may be...it.

“Allegations that find favor in the public sphere of gossip & innuendo cannot be a substitute for procedure in federal court. Plaintiffs have not moved the needle for their fraud theory from conceivable to plausible, which they must do to state a claim under Federal pleading standards.”
-US District Judge Diane Humetewa, decimating Trump's lies
Quote this message in a reply
Sing-I'llSway
Equal Opportunity Skeptic
User ID: 575251
01-23-2021 02:08 AM

Posts: 5,705




Post: #53
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Xor  Wrote: (01-23-2021 01:22 AM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (01-22-2021 06:55 PM)
The thing to consider is the oumuamua is basically identical to the spaceship found on the dark side of the moon.

It's not there anymore, I ran out of helium 3 and had to park it, until I could collect more.

That's a drag, man.

Helium's a precious commodity these days. The world feels your pain.

“Allegations that find favor in the public sphere of gossip & innuendo cannot be a substitute for procedure in federal court. Plaintiffs have not moved the needle for their fraud theory from conceivable to plausible, which they must do to state a claim under Federal pleading standards.”
-US District Judge Diane Humetewa, decimating Trump's lies
Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 575243
01-23-2021 03:50 AM

 




Post: #54
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
BlackCat  Wrote: (01-22-2021 10:08 PM)
longpig  Wrote: (01-22-2021 09:56 PM)
I would think that time would not be one of their parameters. Timing, maybe.

Totally, if you try to hit a target many thousands of years in the future, your calculations better be very, very precise.

That still will not work, as there is no way to factor in the trajectories of objects that have yet to become traveling objects, that being, the shrapnel from large objects that will inevitably be impacted after said projectile is launched.

To avoid such incident, said projectile would need the ability to deviate from course and then back.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 575243
01-23-2021 03:56 AM

 




Post: #55
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Sing-IllSway  Wrote: (01-23-2021 02:07 AM)
Sure. Basically, the more I learn and watch and read, the more I've just been blown away by HOW MANY variables had to fall into place for us to evolve long enough to "get smart".

snip

But you are only thinking in terms that all intelligent life must be as human.

That is a very finite thought process.
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Ms Johanna Strange
Registered User
User ID: 481516
01-23-2021 04:15 AM

Posts: 2,946




Post: #56
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Sing-IllSway  Wrote: (01-23-2021 02:07 AM)
NormalIsSubjective  Wrote: (01-23-2021 12:59 AM)
"parameters", such as?

Sure. Basically, the more I learn and watch and read, the more I've just been blown away by HOW MANY variables had to fall into place for us to evolve long enough to "get smart".

For instance, our position within the Milky Way itself.
We are located within a VERY favorable "neighborhood" of the galaxy.

We're far back (about halfway back to the edge) from the core. This is good news because the core is a hellscape of HIGHLY-ionizing radiation from countless black holes, neutron stars, magnetars, etc all crowded together.

We're located in an outgrowth of the Orion Arm, sometimes called a "spur", which is safely far away from any objects that could harm us, such as massive stars that could explode as supernovae.

Our region of the Orion Spur is also a particularly low-density area. It's sometimes called "The Local Bubble". The bubble was likely blown out by the ancient supernova that contributed to our Sun's birth (by compressing a nearby molecular cloud.)

As a result, there are no stars nearby enough to disrupt our Oort Cloud, a cloud of comets surrounding the Sun in a sphere. Passing stars could perturb those comets, and send them hurtling towards the inner solar system. Certain extinction level events are postulated to have happened this way, if I remember correctly.

So we're safely isolated in a reasonably quiet region of the Milky Way. For this, we're lucky.




Our Sun is not a binary (IT MIGHT BE; there's legit research going into whether there's a "dark companion" out beyond Neptune, but nothing hazardous to the point I'm about to explain.)

Planets can form and "survive" in binary systems, but they're not terribly stable. And there's no guarantee they won't be inevitably kicked out of the system via gravitational perturbation.

It's much better for us that the Sun is a solo act (or at least does not have a SIGNIFICANT companion.)





Our Sun is a very well-behaved, mild-mannered middle-aged star that will not explode on us.
Furthermore, it's not a flare star (many are, such as our closest neighbor, Proxima Centauri), which would surely prevent us from evolving to high intelligence.

For five billion years our Sun has basically just done its thing, remaining quite consistent (it has its 10-yearish cycles, but that's no threat to civilization.) This enabled us to evolve.

As a yellow dwarf, the Sun has provided us with none of the problems many other stars do.

For instance, Red dwarves (which Proxima Centauri is) are the most common star-type in the universe, and they tend to be chaotic, dangerous flare stars.

Blue stars tend to be giant monsters who burn through their nuclear fuel and go supernova sometimes in only millions of years, which is not nearly long enough for any species to evolve to high intelligence.

Our Sun is a mild-mannered yellow dwarf, and we continue to benefit from that to this day.





We have a Jupiter.
It's not commonly known, but we really do owe our civilization to Jupiter. As the most massive object besides the Sun in our solar system, its gravity well is VERY deep, and as a result it has "captured" countless "moons" over billions of years that would otherwise have certainly bashed into Earth.

It's not hyperbole to refer to Jupiter as a "guardian angel".

We're lucky to have it.






We have our Moon.
First, the creation of the moon (LIKELY in a collision with a "Mars-sized object" billions of years ago) resulted in our slight axial tilt, which results in our seasons.

Those seasons are solidified by the gravitational force of the moon.

This matters because it resulted in predictable seasons. Agriculture was able to develop because our ancestors caught on to the patterns of the seasons. And they could DEPEND on the seasons.

And you can't have civilization without agriculture.

Without the stabilizing force of our moon, the seasons would be chaotic and literally unpredictable. It would be similar to the seasons portrayed in "Game of Thrones".

We're very, very lucky to have the moon we do. There would likely be no civilization without it.






Of course, we are in the "goldilocks" region of our solar system, which is the orbital area within which water won't freeze uncontrollably or evaporate uncontrollably.

But even being in the "goldilocks" region didn't guarantee us anything. Just ask Venus (God knows what happened there...).





All of these randoms things, and more (this is just what I thought up off the top of my head sitting here) have to fall into place for stability to last long enough on Earth for us to evolve into "smart" individuals.


We have to be safely far back from the galactic core.
We have to safely far back from any potential supernovae.
We have to safely far back from the influence of any nearby nebulae giving off harmful radiation.
We have to be NOT in a hazardous binary star system.
We need a Moon.
We need a collision early in our history to arrange our axial tilt.
We need a well-behaved star that won't blow up on us, or sterilize the planet with periodic powerful flares.
We need a Jupiter.
We need to be in a solar system that isn't crowded with debris that can regularly smash into us.
We need to be in the "goldilocks" zone.
We need to not turn into Venus.
We need to have our Oort Cloud NOT be perturbed regularly by any nearby neighbors.


The universe is just SO hostile to anything alive. It's SO treacherous. And if just one of the above listed things doesn't fall into place, catastrophe occurs and humanity never evolves into "intelligence".

The facts about our moon and its formation particularly blow my mind. Just an INCREDIBLY fortuitous event.

I mean, there COULD BE some United Federation of Planets out there. Who knows. I would actually love that.

I just personally find it profoundly unlikely

I really do believe we may be...it.

Good post.

http://confessionsofasupervillain.blogspot.com
An ongoing novel in gyres and flashes.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 570870
01-23-2021 05:48 AM

 




Post: #57
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Precursors to our binary star.


"Ultima Thule" .

Labeled as an interstellar visitor or a "contact binary," .


"486958 Arrokoth, provisional designation 2014 MU69, is a trans-Neptunian object located in ... At the time of the New Horizons flyby, the object had been nicknamed Ultima Thule.

Rare atomic element, mu69 was the original designation on the periodic tables .

"Interstellar visitors" , that's the term chosen for the debris returning
In front of the binary and its ancient elliptical journey thru time.



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Estrella
Forum Mascot
User ID: 575290
01-23-2021 08:36 AM

Posts: 3,289




Post: #58
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
It's actually pronounced yo' momma
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Estrella
Forum Mascot
User ID: 575290
01-23-2021 08:37 AM

Posts: 3,289




Post: #59
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
longpig  Wrote: (01-22-2021 06:41 PM)
...but I'm a conspiracy theorist.

the best kind of theorist!
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NormalIsSubjective

User ID: 573345
01-23-2021 07:43 PM

Posts: 17,331




Post: #60
RE: ʻOumuamua Anyone?
Sing-IllSway  Wrote: (01-23-2021 02:07 AM)
NormalIsSubjective  Wrote: (01-23-2021 12:59 AM)
"parameters", such as?

Sure. Basically, the more I learn and watch and read, the more I've just been blown away by HOW MANY variables had to fall into place for us to evolve long enough to "get smart".

For instance, our position within the Milky Way itself.
We are located within a VERY favorable "neighborhood" of the galaxy.

We're far back (about halfway back to the edge) from the core. This is good news because the core is a hellscape of HIGHLY-ionizing radiation from countless black holes, neutron stars, magnetars, etc all crowded together.

We're located in an outgrowth of the Orion Arm, sometimes called a "spur", which is safely far away from any objects that could harm us, such as massive stars that could explode as supernovae.

Our region of the Orion Spur is also a particularly low-density area. It's sometimes called "The Local Bubble". The bubble was likely blown out by the ancient supernova that contributed to our Sun's birth (by compressing a nearby molecular cloud.)

As a result, there are no stars nearby enough to disrupt our Oort Cloud, a cloud of comets surrounding the Sun in a sphere. Passing stars could perturb those comets, and send them hurtling towards the inner solar system. Certain extinction level events are postulated to have happened this way, if I remember correctly.

So we're safely isolated in a reasonably quiet region of the Milky Way. For this, we're lucky.




Our Sun is not a binary (IT MIGHT BE; there's legit research going into whether there's a "dark companion" out beyond Neptune, but nothing hazardous to the point I'm about to explain.)

Planets can form and "survive" in binary systems, but they're not terribly stable. And there's no guarantee they won't be inevitably kicked out of the system via gravitational perturbation.

It's much better for us that the Sun is a solo act (or at least does not have a SIGNIFICANT companion.)





Our Sun is a very well-behaved, mild-mannered middle-aged star that will not explode on us.
Furthermore, it's not a flare star (many are, such as our closest neighbor, Proxima Centauri), which would surely prevent us from evolving to high intelligence.

For five billion years our Sun has basically just done its thing, remaining quite consistent (it has its 10-yearish cycles, but that's no threat to civilization.) This enabled us to evolve.

As a yellow dwarf, the Sun has provided us with none of the problems many other stars do.

For instance, Red dwarves (which Proxima Centauri is) are the most common star-type in the universe, and they tend to be chaotic, dangerous flare stars.

Blue stars tend to be giant monsters who burn through their nuclear fuel and go supernova sometimes in only millions of years, which is not nearly long enough for any species to evolve to high intelligence.

Our Sun is a mild-mannered yellow dwarf, and we continue to benefit from that to this day.





We have a Jupiter.
It's not commonly known, but we really do owe our civilization to Jupiter. As the most massive object besides the Sun in our solar system, its gravity well is VERY deep, and as a result it has "captured" countless "moons" over billions of years that would otherwise have certainly bashed into Earth.

It's not hyperbole to refer to Jupiter as a "guardian angel".

We're lucky to have it.






We have our Moon.
First, the creation of the moon (LIKELY in a collision with a "Mars-sized object" billions of years ago) resulted in our slight axial tilt, which results in our seasons.

Those seasons are solidified by the gravitational force of the moon.

This matters because it resulted in predictable seasons. Agriculture was able to develop because our ancestors caught on to the patterns of the seasons. And they could DEPEND on the seasons.

And you can't have civilization without agriculture.

Without the stabilizing force of our moon, the seasons would be chaotic and literally unpredictable. It would be similar to the seasons portrayed in "Game of Thrones".

We're very, very lucky to have the moon we do. There would likely be no civilization without it.






Of course, we are in the "goldilocks" region of our solar system, which is the orbital area within which water won't freeze uncontrollably or evaporate uncontrollably.

But even being in the "goldilocks" region didn't guarantee us anything. Just ask Venus (God knows what happened there...).





All of these randoms things, and more (this is just what I thought up off the top of my head sitting here) have to fall into place for stability to last long enough on Earth for us to evolve into "smart" individuals.


We have to be safely far back from the galactic core.
We have to safely far back from any potential supernovae.
We have to safely far back from the influence of any nearby nebulae giving off harmful radiation.
We have to be NOT in a hazardous binary star system.
We need a Moon.
We need a collision early in our history to arrange our axial tilt.
We need a well-behaved star that won't blow up on us, or sterilize the planet with periodic powerful flares.
We need a Jupiter.
We need to be in a solar system that isn't crowded with debris that can regularly smash into us.
We need to be in the "goldilocks" zone.
We need to not turn into Venus.
We need to have our Oort Cloud NOT be perturbed regularly by any nearby neighbors.


The universe is just SO hostile to anything alive. It's SO treacherous. And if just one of the above listed things doesn't fall into place, catastrophe occurs and humanity never evolves into "intelligence".

The facts about our moon and its formation particularly blow my mind. Just an INCREDIBLY fortuitous event.

I mean, there COULD BE some United Federation of Planets out there. Who knows. I would actually love that.

I just personally find it profoundly unlikely

I really do believe we may be...it.


Your parameters are human-centric, there is no reason to believe our model for life is the only one that has prevailed.


The universe is a very big place, we've barely begun to explore our solar system never mind our galaxy.

At ~14 billion years it's also a very old place, while the Earth is only ~4 billion years.

Plenty of time and space for any manner of opportunities for intelligent life to arise.
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