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Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 450140
07-13-2018 12:30 AM

 



Post: #241
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
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Croow  Wrote: (07-12-2018 07:28 AM)
Wow, as someone that has personally built jet engines and aircraft, this is insane. How is this thread 16 pages long. All for freedom of speech, but good lord, know something about it before you post a thread and present it as fact.

Axial jets require fuel to power the high pressure turbine to spin the compressor blades/by pass turbo fans. (Producing lift)

Personally put together a J34 engine. No fuel, no thrust.

In your original video, they disconnected the after burner fuel. Fuel was still supplied to the combustion chambers to spin the high and low pressure turbines.

J34 is a very old obsolete engine. It lacks certain "components" of more modern-day jet engines that allow the incoming air to be compressed so significantly that the air reaches temperatures so intense that it requires no liquid fuel source for normal operations.

Short and sweet: Air in modern jet engines are compressed in a manner to which produces high enough temperatures resulting in no need for liquid fuel to be introduced into the combustion chamber.

Todays jet engines are actually started by use of compressed air until the engine spools up enough to run on air alone.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 450147
07-13-2018 12:41 AM

 



Post: #242
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
LoP Guest  Wrote: (07-13-2018 12:30 AM)
Croow  Wrote: (07-12-2018 07:28 AM)
Wow, as someone that has personally built jet engines and aircraft, this is insane. How is this thread 16 pages long. All for freedom of speech, but good lord, know something about it before you post a thread and present it as fact.

Axial jets require fuel to power the high pressure turbine to spin the compressor blades/by pass turbo fans. (Producing lift)

Personally put together a J34 engine. No fuel, no thrust.

In your original video, they disconnected the after burner fuel. Fuel was still supplied to the combustion chambers to spin the high and low pressure turbines.

J34 is a very old obsolete engine. It lacks certain "components" of more modern-day jet engines that allow the incoming air to be compressed so significantly that the air reaches temperatures so intense that it requires no liquid fuel source for normal operations.

Short and sweet: Air in modern jet engines are compressed in a manner to which produces high enough temperatures resulting in no need for liquid fuel to be introduced into the combustion chamber.

Todays jet engines are actually started by use of compressed air until the engine spools up enough to run on air alone.

Rofl

Just like the flattards your beliefs are a pick a mix of nonsense.
Fueltard A claims they need fuel to get started.
Fueltard B claims they use compressed air.

No fueltard will demonstrate the combustion of the atmosphere under any conditions despite that being the crux if their claims.
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Travel assistant
lop guest
User ID: 435697
07-13-2018 01:29 AM

 



Post: #243
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
As someone who has personally flown a lot and noticing only minimal attempts to refuel All the aircraft I think it is insane that so few other people see this.My challenge stands
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 416238
07-13-2018 02:09 AM

 



Post: #244
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Travel assistant  Wrote: (07-13-2018 01:29 AM)
As someone who has personally flown a lot and noticing only minimal attempts to refuel All the aircraft I think it is insane that so few other people see this.My challenge stands

I think you meant to post as panty wad.
They were the one with a "challenge".
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 416238
07-13-2018 02:10 AM

 



Post: #245
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Knickertwister  Wrote: (07-12-2018 04:40 AM)
My challenge stands

See? ^^^^

Wrong sock fuckwit.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 416238
07-13-2018 02:47 AM

 



Post: #246
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Awww.

I wanted you to make up some horseshit reason you were talking about a challenge you didn't make.

lol
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 447728
07-13-2018 02:49 AM

 



Post: #247
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
:thumbup thanks for keeping the stupid corralled here!

Hugs
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Travel assistant
lop guest
User ID: 435697
07-13-2018 02:53 AM

 



Post: #248
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
The deeper we go down the rabbit hole the more the world views you as a loon.So be it.This is the lunatic outpost you would think it would be more friendly to us true loons.Posers to the back of the class you know the drill!!!
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 416238
07-13-2018 03:00 AM

 



Post: #249
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Travel assistant  Wrote: (07-13-2018 02:53 AM)
The deeper we go down the rabbit hole the more the world views you as a loon.So be it.This is the lunatic outpost you would think it would be more friendly to us true loons.Posers to the back of the class you know the drill!!!

But what about your challenge?
Does it still stand panty wad?
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Knickertwister
lop guest
User ID: 435697
07-13-2018 03:13 AM

 



Post: #250
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Yes I still request some one to post several pics of a late model fighter jet mig 29 or f 35 then we can all debate how many drums of fuel you could fit in it . That is my Challenge Repeated for the last time,sigh
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270110nli
lop guest
User ID: 436672
07-13-2018 04:12 AM

 



Post: #251
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
LoP Guest  Wrote: (07-12-2018 12:30 PM)
pie  Wrote: (07-12-2018 10:47 AM)
The oxygen in the air allows fuel to bun, ie oxidize.
In other words, you need something to oxidize, ie fuel.

What's so hard to understand about that?

If we didn't need that, then the whole planet would just simply be on fire, constantly, till the oxygen runs out.

The best take!

agreed. and it is my understanding that exactly that happens in an oxygen rich environment.

snipcorrect in stating that the O2 content at sea level is typically 20.9 percent. However, some chemical process can produce free oxygen, increasing the content. An atmosphere at around 22 percent, while not detrimental to health, can cause materials to combust spontaneously, especially hydrocarbons, such as oil, grease and fuels.

But something as inocous as oil contamination an O2 tank threads is HIGHLY combustible...open the valve, hi-pressure 02 hits the threads with oil...and KABOOM! Tank will rocket off loike a missile.

also it is well known that you cannot release liquid hydrogen and/or oxygen at a rate above a specific amount or it will self combust. (again seemingly just due to having any oxygen whatsoever in the case of hydrogen, and any other small amount of any other reactive gas or thermal reactance such as ozone in the case of oxygen)

this is why NASA requires[d] SOLID BOOSTERS on the first stage.
it couldnt be liquid or gas directly because it would self combust so to speak (because of the extremely high delivery rate required to over come earths gravity)


now back to a car for a minute and why was joe mentioning Air–fuel ratio. ... In an internal combustion engine or industrial furnace, the air-fuel ratio is an important measure for anti-pollution and performance-tuning reasons. If exactly enough air is provided to completely burn all of the fuel, the ratio is known as the stoichiometric mixture, often abbreviated to stoich. which is usually 14.1 Air/Fuel Ratio for a gasoline piston engine.

so its mostly breathing air

planes
The combustion efficiency of most aircraft gas turbine engines at sea level takeoff conditions is almost 100%. It decreases nonlinearly to 98% at altitude cruise conditions. Air-fuel ratio ranges from 50:1 to 130:1.

that ish is burnin AIR like a mutherfucker!

so much so, compared to the amount of diesel its burnin, that it leads to a thread title such as we have here in this thread.

back to cars and planes
it is well known in the auto racecar world that the car really burns air.

thats why the first thing they did to make those munster dragsters was to put that diesel supercharger on a gasoline engine.

then turbochargers when they figured that out, and what to do with the heat (intercoolers)

all to force more AIR into the engine

just so it could burn a little more fuel.

you cant just dump fuel into things.

for one thing, they call it gasoline for a reason. cars dont directly burn liquid they burn gas.

planes use afterburners for the same reason. more airflow through that turbine jet.

so whether you run cars from water using the derived gases
or gasoline

its exactly the same thing. or other gases like propane.

it still needs much more air than fuel.

and in the airplanes case its nominally 100 parts air (to 150 or so) to 1 part fuel) and even if it gets real bad gas mileage it still cant be worse than 50:1 or the damn thing is getting ready to blow up due to a severe malfunction.

same with a car with that 14:1

if you put only 5 parts air with one part "gas" you will need a new engine.
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270110nli
lop guest
User ID: 436672
07-13-2018 04:21 AM

 



Post: #252
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Knickertwister  Wrote: (07-13-2018 03:13 AM)
Yes I still request some one to post several pics of a late model fighter jet mig 29 or f 35 then we can all debate how many drums of fuel you could fit in it . That is my Challenge Repeated for the last time,sigh

ok this reminds me of the flyboyair thingy and whether or not that was possible due to the required fuel for those 4 jet engines.

and the answer was it was right on the money for a 90 second flight time.
(for the proto and the vid this seemed reasonable, and did agree with the engine specs)(each engine burned half a gal a minute and it had room for exactly three gallons of fuel, so it checked out)


and that was hard work.
it took me a few weeks to find actual engineering trials and dyno tests for these jet engines and how much fuel they burned in actual practice.


for the mig 29 it seems easier?

i started with the external ballast tanks and their ratings and converted the pounds to gallons, and then visualized 55 gallon drums and added up the physical space requirements and it seemed to add up just like that flyboy.

so far so good.

now i need the autocad drawings to figure out where the internal tanks are
how big and whatnot, especially their interior volume.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 450083
07-13-2018 04:23 AM

 



Post: #253
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Knickertwister  Wrote: (07-13-2018 03:13 AM)
Yes I still request some one to post several pics of a late model fighter jet mig 29 or f 35 then we can all debate how many drums of fuel you could fit in it . That is my Challenge Repeated for the last time,sigh

You put on the correct sock this time.
Bravo! Applause

Seems no one wants to play "guesses are better than facts science" with you.

Poor you.
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Knickertwister
lop guest
User ID: 435697
07-13-2018 04:32 AM

 



Post: #254
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
I,m still waiting for the picture....My Challenge Stands.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 450083
07-13-2018 04:34 AM

 



Post: #255
RE: Do Jet Planes Run Solely On Air - not on aviation fuel
Knickertwister  Wrote: (07-13-2018 04:32 AM)
I,m still waiting for the picture....My Challenge Stands.

Crybaby

Does panty wad need a binkie, a bottle, and a nap?
Maybe post as T&A and pretend to have a conversation?
Maybe get yer own damn pic?
Maybe stop wasting our time?
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