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Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 409341
06-19-2017 02:39 AM

 



Post: #31
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
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People who have been blind from birth have been able to see during their nde.
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Bronco Bama
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User ID: 420882
06-20-2017 12:51 AM

Posts: 1,272



Post: #32
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-18-2017 06:30 PM)
Bronco Bama  Wrote: (06-18-2017 06:15 PM)
I see no reason to believe that NDEs are anything but a product of the mind. I don't deny that the people who experience them have been emotionally affected by them, but that's not evidence that these people have left their bodies or gone to some afterlife or whatever.

The best objection is the fact that these people claim to "see" and "hear" things while "outside" their bodies, even though seeing and hearing require eyes and ears. "Sight" is a complex process that depends on the eye to refract light that passes from the environment. Sound is a complex process requiring an ear to gather sound waves. In a very literal way, "sight" and "sound" don't exist without these organs present. It's no different than trying to run a computer program without a computer.

You think eyes and ears are doing the work when you are dreaming?

A dream is a collection of images no different than when you think or daydream.

. . . Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds.
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Bronco Bama
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User ID: 420882
06-20-2017 12:54 AM

Posts: 1,272



Post: #33
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
Sarah  Wrote: (06-18-2017 06:34 PM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-18-2017 06:30 PM)
[quote='Bronco Bama' pid='14435264' dateline='1497802509']
I see no reason to believe that NDEs are anything but a product of the mind. I don't deny that the people who experience them have been emotionally affected by them, but that's not evidence that these people have left their bodies or gone to some afterlife or whatever.

Quote:You think eyes and ears are doing the work when you are dreaming?

Jhikpghf

and the reason you don't think it's possible is because you've never had one. There is plenty of proof that these are not just a product of the mind in accounts of people who have died and come back, describing everything that was going on in the operating room, right down to the music that was playing, while they were dead.

Well, until there's evidence, I see no reason to believe. There have been many attempts to verify OBEs by placing hidden messages above operating rooms, and yet not once has anyone who's claimed an OBE or NDE in such a hospital ever accurately reported the words of the message.

. . . Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds.
(This post was last modified: 06-20-2017 12:54 AM by Bronco Bama.) Quote this message in a reply
Bronco Bama
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User ID: 420882
06-20-2017 12:56 AM

Posts: 1,272



Post: #34
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
Sarah  Wrote: (06-19-2017 01:28 AM)
Heir  Wrote: (06-18-2017 07:09 PM)
Having one certainly changes Ones outlook .

Jhikpghf

People generally disbelieve anything they haven't seen proof of for themselves.

But what about people who've had them and still think they're a product of the brain?

. . . Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds.
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Bronco Bama
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06-20-2017 12:59 AM

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Post: #35
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-19-2017 02:39 AM)
People who have been blind from birth have been able to see during their nde.

Someone who's been "blind from birth" wouldn't even be able to comprehend sight at first. We see this all the time in blind people who undergo successful vision surgery. An adult seeing for the first time can take years to acclimate to the simple idea that "far away = small/close = large." Most of these people never acquire the ability to interpret drawings or art; their brains see mere lines and blotches of color.

. . . Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds.
(This post was last modified: 06-20-2017 01:00 AM by Bronco Bama.) Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
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06-21-2017 02:06 AM

 



Post: #36
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
Bronco Bama  Wrote: (06-20-2017 12:59 AM)
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-19-2017 02:39 AM)
People who have been blind from birth have been able to see during their nde.

Someone who's been "blind from birth" wouldn't even be able to comprehend sight at first. We see this all the time in blind people who undergo successful vision surgery. An adult seeing for the first time can take years to acclimate to the simple idea that "far away = small/close = large." Most of these people never acquire the ability to interpret drawings or art; their brains see mere lines and blotches of color.
I agree that it would be difficult for people who have been blind all their lives to "comprehend" what was happening to them, but the fact remains that they SEE. They have no capability to see through their physical eyes which means that when they see during their nde they are seeing with a sense of sight that is not physical. This is evidence that our senses, such as sight, sound, smell, etc., are not limited to our physical organs. There is a non-physical part of man that also can see, hear, smell, and experience all the things the physical body experiences.
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Bronco Bama
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06-22-2017 01:42 AM

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Post: #37
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
rLoP Guest  Wrote: (06-21-2017 02:06 AM)
Bronco Bama  Wrote: (06-20-2017 12:59 AM)
Someone who's been "blind from birth" wouldn't even be able to comprehend sight at first. We see this all the time in blind people who undergo successful vision surgery. An adult seeing for the first time can take years to acclimate to the simple idea that "far away = small/close = large." Most of these people never acquire the ability to interpret drawings or art; their brains see mere lines and blotches of color.
I agree that it would be difficult for people who have been blind all their lives to "comprehend" what was happening to them, but the fact remains that they SEE. They have no capability to see through their physical eyes which means that when they see during their nde they are seeing with a sense of sight that is not physical. This is evidence that our senses, such as sight, sound, smell, etc., are not limited to our physical organs. There is a non-physical part of man that also can see, hear, smell, and experience all the things the physical body experiences.

But all you have at best is anecdotal stories and claims. There's no evidence.

Quote:This is evidence that our senses, such as sight, sound, smell, etc., are not limited to our physical organs. There is a non-physical part of man that also can see, hear, smell, and experience all the things the physical body experiences.

So if I poke out your eyes, you won't be blind?

. . . Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds.
(This post was last modified: 06-22-2017 01:44 AM by Bronco Bama.) Quote this message in a reply
LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 410821
06-22-2017 01:49 AM

 



Post: #38
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
personal experiences

i have never had a NDE

BUT

i HAVE had TWO
OBEs

the first
I was YOUNG
but remember clearly...
I was 9 at the dentist
I HATED the dentist because of the hook he used to pull the cheek back
that thing hurt

so....
I was floating above myself looking down at the back of my head
I saw my mother, the dentist, everything
then when it was over
I went back


I have no idea how this happened


the next

I was 17
I dove off a high dive at the school pool
and hit a kid swimming underneath me
I broke his collarbone and forearm
(he was doing the backstroke)
I had a MASSIVE concussion
I saw stars
I ALL MOST blacked out

what I have learned


there is SOMETHING that takes over when you loose consciousness
light


there is also something about US
that lives on out of body

I believe they are one in the same


light
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 419063
06-22-2017 02:06 AM

 



Post: #39
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
LoP Guest  Wrote: (06-18-2017 04:21 PM)
Unless they have nephilim blood, I doubt they where really dead. It was a trip created by their mind.

When I died, and I was dead for over an hour(California head rush stupidity), I had a death trip, given my mental state, it was of neither heaven nor hell, just a somber car ride. After that, like a VHS tape coming to an end: nothingness.

No thought's, no sounds, no feeling, no sight, nothing, yet I was able to perceive and remember the nothing.

Time, or rather the perception of time, was nonexistent. It felt like both thousands of ages(ten's of thousands of years), and mere moments. There was a flicker of light, and I felt being pulled backwards, and was alive again.

Dead for over an hour? I doubt that very much.
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LoP Guest
lop guest
User ID: 409341
06-23-2017 02:25 AM

 



Post: #40
RE: Near Death Experiences - First Hand Encounters
Bronco Bama  Wrote: (06-22-2017 01:42 AM)
rLoP Guest  Wrote: (06-21-2017 02:06 AM)
I agree that it would be difficult for people who have been blind all their lives to "comprehend" what was happening to them, but the fact remains that they SEE. They have no capability to see through their physical eyes which means that when they see during their nde they are seeing with a sense of sight that is not physical. This is evidence that our senses, such as sight, sound, smell, etc., are not limited to our physical organs. There is a non-physical part of man that also can see, hear, smell, and experience all the things the physical body experiences.

But all you have at best is anecdotal stories and claims. There's no evidence.

Quote:This is evidence that our senses, such as sight, sound, smell, etc., are not limited to our physical organs. There is a non-physical part of man that also can see, hear, smell, and experience all the things the physical body experiences.

So if I poke out your eyes, you won't be blind?
There is plenty of evidence. Blind people have had these experience during time in a hospital surrounded by medical staff. Do the research. Here's just one example to get you started.




The blind people who are seeing during the nde are not seeing with their physical eyes. So poking someone's physical eye out is not the way to test how a person sees during the nde.
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