Look, as a democrat, I will gladly admit Obama was a good president, but maybe not a great president. He has some failings as president. He screwed some things up.

However, the people who still support Trump are delusional. Every president has done something wrong, no one is a saint. But in their eyes, Trump literally cannot do anything wrong.

These people criticized Obama and his family for the entire duration of his presidency, but when the shoe was on the other foot, every similar shortcoming Trump had was excusable.

Obama took vacations. Every president has, but he was lambasted constantly for "vacationing too much". Never mind the fact George W. Bush took over 500 vacation days, seldom mentioned.

Trump said as President, that he would not have time to vacation, he would be way to
busy helping the country.

Well guess what? He has gone on vacations, lots of them in fact. In fact, he spent nearly 30% of his 1st year as president at Trump owned properties.

So now, the excuses fly.

"He is working when he goes to his his properties". OK, fair enough, but every time he decides to leave the WH, it costs me and you money. So far that amount has come to over 80 million dollars.

The whole time Obama was in office, 8 years, the total taxpayers spent on vacations was around 100 million dollars. Trump has not been in office 2 years, and has already spent about 37 million on flights to Mar a Lago. By the time he has 2 years in, that number will be close to half of what the Obama's spent, with trump spending it in 1/4th as short of time.

Each trip to Trump's Mar a Lago costs over 3 million dollars in fuel and secret service protection.

If we put vacations aside, morals come into play as well, modestly specifically.

If you recall, around 2009 Michelle Obama was criticized heavily for wearing a dress with bare arms. How provocative, right?

Well, as many already know, the current 1st lady, Melania posed naked. But again, more silence from the right. I guess this excuses her behavior?

I could go on all day about this, but the point is, somehow these people can find no fault in Trump's work, and any readily apparent mistake he made is somehow given a half-assed excuse by the right.

Apostle of Reality  Wrote: (12-06-2018 07:57 PM)

That also included premier people, for Russian expertise.

How did firing them, help the United States security at a time when the intelligence agencies have pointed to Russian interference, including Trump's own administration?

How would that NOT be a need for governmental purpose? Hint: It was political retribution and attempting to delay an investigation, also a crime.

Please list these "premier" people that you claim lost clearances.

You do know that there are people IN government that are doing the jobs of the ex-officials.

Your insane argument is that somebody who is fired or has quit should continue to have access to company premises and systems. Generally when someone is fired they are duck-walked off the property and all their access is terminated.



Your argument is so stupid it doesn't deserve refutation.

Apostle of Reality  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:03 PM)

He's involved in the planned kidnapping of a Turkish person in exile, contacting Russia during the transition about Obama's sanctions, inferring the reply to the quid for helping, and also contact of Russia to block a UN resolution against Israel using Russia's veto against a sitting president (Sedition) but directed to do so by a very senior official.

There's also a completely redacted investigation.

Me again

Just when we read in the disclosure to court “ provided very substantial information and assistance”. That made me perk up

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:07 PM)

Please list these "premier" people that you claim lost clearances.

You do know that there are people IN government that are doing the jobs of the ex-officials.

Your insane argument is that somebody who is fired or has quit should continue to have access to company premises and systems. Generally when someone is fired they are duck-walked off the property and all their access is terminated.



Your argument is so stupid it doesn't deserve refutation.

If you insist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Strzok

A career employee with the FBI for 22 years before his firing in August 2018,[27] Strzok had been a lead agent in the FBI's "Operation Ghost Stories" against Andrey Bezrukov and Yelena Vavilova, a Russian spy couple who were part of the Illegals Program, a network of Russian sleeper agents who were arrested in 2010.[28] By July 2015, Strzok was serving as the section chief of the Counterespionage Section, a subordinate section of the FBI's Counterintelligence Division.

Bruce Ohr,

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/27/us/po...tment.html

As the lawyer made his pitch, a supervising F.B.I. agent and a senior career Justice Department official, Bruce G. Ohr, both listened intently, according to a former bureau official who described the meeting. The case was significant for American law enforcement. It had made headlines and laid the groundwork for Justice Department efforts to combat Russian organized crime overseas.

Finally, the F.B.I. agent spoke. No deal, he said; Mr. Mogilevich must surrender. Mr. Ohr said little, but his unwillingness to negotiate was signal enough: The Justice Department would not compromise with the Russian mafia.

Shall we continue?

Or you can answer the question.

How is Trump NOT a traitor?

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:08 PM)

Me again

Just when we read in the disclosure to court “ provided very substantial information and assistance”. That made me perk up

I'm beyond that. The biggest sentences are right here:

link to image: https://cdn.themoscowproject.org/content...ASSAGE.png

Apostle of Reality  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:30 PM)

I'm beyond that. The biggest sentences are right here:

link to image: https://cdn.themoscowproject.org/content...ASSAGE.png

I’ve not seen that yet

That is incredibly damning

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:08 PM)

I’ve not seen that yet

That is incredibly damning

Mueller is wrapping things up...

He is working on his report.

And soon we will know - since someone on the SSCI (Feinstein or Warner) or some House member (Adam Schitt) will leak it.

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:39 PM)

Mueller is wrapping things up...

He is working on his report.

And soon we will know - since someone on the SSCI (Feinstein or Warner) or some House member (Adam Schitt) will leak it.

Soon... soon....soon...
You sound like fundie Christians predicting the return of christ.
Two years we've been told Trump is done.
Trump will be impeached.
Trumps is a traitor.
Soon.
Soon.
Soon.

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:39 PM)

Mueller is wrapping things up...

He is working on his report.

And soon we will know - since someone on the SSCI (Feinstein or Warner) or some House member (Adam Schitt) will leak it.

Soon... soon....soon...
You sound like fundie Christians predicting the return of christ.
Two years we've been told Trump is done.
Trump will be impeached.
Trumps is a traitor.
Soon.
Soon.
Soon.

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:56 PM)

Soon... soon....soon...
You sound like fundie Christians predicting the return of christ.
Two years we've been told Trump is done.
Trump will be impeached.
Trumps is a traitor.
Soon.
Soon.
Soon.

Don't know what will come out of the report.

It will make Trump look bad - but that kind of investigation will make anyone look bad.

The question is:

Is the report worse than the leaks?

If the report is better than the leaks - it will be a plus for Trump.

Given the Democrats actively conspired with the Russians and British to create a fake dossier, it probably will show Trump is better than the Democrats.

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:56 PM)

Soon... soon....soon...
You sound like fundie Christians predicting the return of christ.
Two years we've been told Trump is done.
Trump will be impeached.
Trumps is a traitor.
Soon.
Soon.
Soon.

It’s taken that long due to republican obstruction

LoP Guest  Wrote: (12-06-2018 09:08 PM)

I’ve not seen that yet

That is incredibly damning

Mueller is wrapping things up...

He is working on his report.

And soon we will know - since someone on the SSCI (Feinstein or Warner) or some House member (Adam Schitt) will leak it.

Apostle of Reality  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:29 PM)

If you insist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Strzok

A career employee with the FBI for 22 years before his firing in August 2018,[27] Strzok had been a lead agent in the FBI's "Operation Ghost Stories" against Andrey Bezrukov and Yelena Vavilova, a Russian spy couple who were part of the Illegals Program, a network of Russian sleeper agents who were arrested in 2010.[28] By July 2015, Strzok was serving as the section chief of the Counterespionage Section, a subordinate section of the FBI's Counterintelligence Division.

Bruce Ohr,

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/27/us/po...tment.html

As the lawyer made his pitch, a supervising F.B.I. agent and a senior career Justice Department official, Bruce G. Ohr, both listened intently, according to a former bureau official who described the meeting. The case was significant for American law enforcement. It had made headlines and laid the groundwork for Justice Department efforts to combat Russian organized crime overseas.

Finally, the F.B.I. agent spoke. No deal, he said; Mr. Mogilevich must surrender. Mr. Ohr said little, but his unwillingness to negotiate was signal enough: The Justice Department would not compromise with the Russian mafia.

Shall we continue?

Or you can answer the question.

How is Trump NOT a traitor?

Boy are you deluded.

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/201...ility.html
Strzok

https://www.naturalnews.com/2018-04-15-b...rimes.html

Strzok was fired for "Lack of Candor".

Ohr has been repeatedly demoted and served as a conduit for a discredited source (Steele) even though he had no reason to be involved, as well as failing to report conflicts of interest.

Some background on the others.
https://themarketswork.com/2018/02/18/re...e-fbi-doj/

At the time that was written.
James Baker – FBI
Peter Strzok – FBI
Lisa Page – FBI/DOJ
Bruce Ohr – DOJ
Bill Priestap – FBI

Were still with the government - Ohr is the only one that still has a job.

Ohr - while being disciplined for numerous indiscretions - has apparently been forthright with investigators, and as far as can be determined still has a security clearance.

Because he (as far as I can tell) has not displayed a "lack of candor" to investigators he still has a job.

But this did lead to some embarrassing revelations about what was going on.

His testimony indicated that Lisa Page and Glenn Simpson were lying.

From the follow-up questioning of Glenn Simpson (who pleaded the fifth) we can conclude that Ohr was right.

Apostle of Reality  Wrote: (12-06-2018 08:30 PM)

I'm beyond that. The biggest sentences are right here:

link to image: https://cdn.themoscowproject.org/content...ASSAGE.png

I’ve not seen that yet

That is incredibly damning